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Reader Participation: The Top 30 Prospects

I'm going to sticky this at the top for the next few days. Keep turning in those ballots.

Star-divide

As news slows down, I find myself starting to run low on things to write about. When this happens, I do what all great writers do, blatantly steal ideas from elsewhere. The source of my newest idea is the SBN Rockies blog Purple Row, and their reader poll of the top 30 prospects in the organization.

The idea is simple, the readers simply make their list of the top prospects, and then they receive points based on where they finished on the ballot, 30 points for first, 29 points for second, etc. After a couple weeks, I tally them all up, and we have an official True Blue L.A. top prospect list.

The one change that I'm going to make is that 30 prospects is asking a bit too much, it brings the list down to some players who have almost zero chance of making the big leagues, and it requires that you spend way too much time watching baseball. The compromise I came up with is that you can vote for anywhere between 10 and 30 prospects, any positions that aren't filled simply won't be counted.

To kick things off, here's my list. Keep in mind how much of a stat guy I am, so players have to actually do something to impress me. I do pay attention to the scouting reports, but players like Preston Mattingly and Josh Wall are going to take a hit. Of course, since I'm not a huge prospect guy in general, I probably left someone of the list. Because of this, my list will be changing over the next couple weeks as people point out my grevious errors.

Rank Player Position Highest Level
1 Scott Elbert LHSP AA
2 Andy LaRoche 3B AAA
3 Clayton Kershaw LHSP GCL
4 James Loney 1B MLB
5 Jonathan Meloan RHRP AA
6 Greg Miller LHRP AAA
7 Josh Bell 3B PIO
8 Bryan Morris RHSP PIO
9 Blake Dewitt 2B AA
10 Tony Abreu 2B AA
11 Justin Orenduff RHSP AA
12 Steven Johnson RHSP PIO
13 Mark Alexander RHRP AAA
14 Preston Mattingly SS GCL
15 Alberto Bastardo LHSP A+
16 Josh Wall RHSP A
17 Travis Denker 2B A+
18 Cory Dunlap 1B A+
19 Wesley Wright LHRP AA
20 Bridger Hunt CF A
21 Chin Lung Hu SS AA
22 Zachary Hammes RHRP AAA
23 Ivan DeJesus SS A
24 Carlos Santana 3B A+
25 Ryan Rogowski OF PIO
26 Delwyn Young OF MLB
27 Brian Akin RHRP AA
28 Eric Hull RHSP AAA
29 Eric Stults LHSP MLB
30 Casey Hoorelbeke RHRP AA

When I put together this list, the big jump down after Mark Alexander and Preston Mattingly was noticeable, as well as the lack of catchers and outfielders in the organization. Still, I had trouble narrowing the list down to 30, and if the biggest problem with the farm system is that it peters off after the first 13 prospects, it's a good sign.

Cast your votes, and in a couple weeks, I'll tally up the results.

Comment 21 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Kemp
Kemp lost his prospect eligibility. He's no longer a rookie.

by Andrew on Dec 18, 2006 3:06 PM PST up reply actions  

My List
  1. Loney
  2. Kemp
  3. Kershaw
  4. Elbert
  5. Miller
  6. Mattingly
  7. Morris
  8. Abreu
  9. Young
  10. Orenduff

by Marty on Dec 18, 2006 2:30 PM PST reply actions  

I like your list
But I'd push Alberto Bastardo up to the ten spot. Just because. Is Mark Alexander really better than my man Bastardo? I suspect not. Morris's ranking has got to be pretty elastic right now, so wherever you put him, it can't really be wrong; but I wouldn't mind not seeing him drop a few spots. I can see putting Elbert over LaRoche, but probably wouldn't have gone for it. Delwyn Young at 26 breaks my heart, a little, but I won't argue about it.

by Andrew Shimmin on Dec 18, 2006 3:34 PM PST reply actions  

Took me a while
But I finally remembered the point; I'll play by the rule, though, not like that cheater Marty. My list:
  1. LaRoche
  2. Elbert
  3. Kershaw
  4. Loney
  5. Miller
  6. Meloan
  7. Dewitt
  8. Orenduff
  9. Morris
  10. Bastardo!

by Andrew Shimmin on Dec 18, 2006 4:35 PM PST up reply actions  

LaRoche
Ha! I forgot to add Andy. I'm worried about his shoulder, but not THAT worried. Substitute Laroche for proven-veteran Kemp.

by Marty on Dec 18, 2006 4:45 PM PST reply actions  

My Top 30
First, a word about criteria.  I made my list keeping in mind (1) scouting reports, (2) stats (with age vs. level of competition factoring in), (3) closeness to the majors, and (4) injury/recovery status.  Pitchers who have had arm surgery and have yet to make a comeback -- i.e., Morris and Orenduff -- are heavily penalized under my criteria, with Orenduff getting hit worse because shoulder injuries to pitchers scare me more than elbow injuries.  LaRoche had labrum surgery on his non-throwing shoulder after the season, but he is a hitter, so I penalized him only slightly, ranking him behind Elbert when I otherwise would have had him before Elbert.  How high I rank Eric Stults may surprise some, but his rank is the result of doing REALLY well in the "closeness to the majors" category, as I think he could be a decent #5 starter right now for a number of MLB teams that don't have the Dodgers' pitching depth.  Also please note that the last two players on the list, #29 and #30, are the only two players about whom I have ZERO scouting information, which is why I refuse to rank them in the top 28, even though they might well deserve a higher rank depending on their skills.

(01). Scott Elbert, LHP
(02). Andy LaRoche, 3B
(03). James Loney, 1B
(04). Clayton Kershaw, LHP
(05). Blake DeWitt, 2B/3B
(06). Jonathan Meloan, RHP
(07). Preston Mattingly, SS
(08). Josh Bell, 3B
(09). Greg Miller, LHP
(10). Tony Abreu, 2B
(11). Chin-Lung Hu, SS
(12). Ivan DeJesus, Jr., SS
(13). Steven Johnson, RHP
(14). Zach Hammes, RHP
(15). Eric Stults, LHP
(16). James McDonald, RHP
(17). Mike Megrew, LHP
(18). Delwyn Young, OF
(19). Xavier Paul, OF
(20). Wesley Wright, LHP
(21). Jesus Castillo, RHP
(22). Bryan Morris, RHP
(23). Mark Alexander, RHP
(24). Javy Guerra, RHP
(25). Cory Dunlap, 1B
(26). Josh Wall, RHP
(27). Justin Orenduff, RHP
(28). Carlos Santana, 3B/OF/C
(29). Marlon Arias, LHP
(30). Alberto Bastardo, LHP

Please feel free to make comments, or ask questions (for instance, you might want to know why I made certain choices, or you might want to know more about the players themselves).

by CanuckDodger on Dec 18, 2006 7:42 PM PST reply actions  

bridger hunt
he should be in the top 20. hes a young college draftee, "only" in his age 20 season last year. I dont have a scouting report on his defense yet but if he can play a decent CF, hes probably top 15. his contact and average skills were excellent and even though his power wasnt very good, im not going to dock him too much. it usually takes a season to transistion from metal to wood bats. But hitting for that high of average right out of a small college program and right in the SAL league is impressive to me.

at season age of 21 next year, hes my breakout propsect for next year in the cal league.

there, its been public, bridget hunt is my 2007 dodger prospect breakoutee.

let it be known around the world.

by npurcell on Dec 18, 2006 9:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Hunt
No fair, I called him first.

by Andrew on Dec 18, 2006 9:37 PM PST up reply actions  

Xavier Paul
Could you explain Xavier Paul to me? I want to know what I'm missing. I know he's got a solid following, but he's not particulary young, he strikes out a ton, doesn't walk much and has decent, but not spectacular stats for an outfielder. I wanted to include him, but couldn't justify it. Why is he ranked so highly.

by Andrew on Dec 18, 2006 9:40 PM PST up reply actions  

X-Man
Andrew, a good question about Xavier Paul.  I disagree that I ranked him "highly."  I mean, he is behind Stults and Young, so he is definitely down among the guys you would expect to be long-shots to have MLB careers.  

I will get into the scouting stuff, which is more important to me, in a second.  You are more interested in the stats, so we'll take a look at that angle first, and you also bring up age.  You say Paul is not "particularly young," but Paul was still "young," being 21 in a league where 22-shading-toward-23 is average.  Chase Utley hit .257/.324/.422 in the FSL at age 22, so you can compare that to Paul's .285/.343/.430.  Adjust for the age difference in one direction, and in the other direction adjust for the fact that Paul's home games were in a more hitter-friendly park, and the performances might come out in the same neighborhood.  Also, take note of the differences in Paul's stats against lefty and righty pitchers.  While managing only a .247/.307/.370 line against southpaws, Paul hit .293/.351/.442 against righties, which is not outstanding against righties, but is enough to think there may be a future in this game for the guy. If a lefty hitter can hit righties, MLB teams are pretty tolerant of futility against lefty pitchers. That's what platoons were made for.

Now for the scouting perspective.  I'll come right out and say it:  Paul is a poor man's Matt Kemp, scouting-wise.  On the positive side, Paul has excellent bat speed: his swing is whip-like, short to the ball, and he finishes high, so the ball carries well when he makes contact. In the outfield, his arm is a cannon, and his throws are very accurate.  Paul also has plus running speed. On the negative side, Paul has poor pitch recognition, which leaves him too often guessing at the plate.  Fielding can be an adventure for Paul because he gets poor reads and jumps on flies, negating much of the value of his speed in the field.  The value of his speed on the basepaths is also compromised by poor base-running technique.  Now the positives and negatives I just listed mirror the positives and negatives of Kemp for the most part, if not entirely.  In other words, the tools are there, they just need to be turned into baseball skills.

Kemp and Paul are the same age (well, Kemp is about five months older).  They were drafted the same year, Paul in the 4th round and Kemp in the 6th.  Has Kemp moved faster, and does he appear to have a brighter future?  Absolutely, which is why I ranked Paul only #19 while if Kemp were still prospect-eligible I would have ranked him #1. But honestly, can we really say that Kemp has made faster "progress" than Paul turning his tools into skills?  I am not so sure.  Kemp still looks like he is learning the game of baseball in so many ways.  I think that the fact that Kemp's tools come in a 6'4 body while Paul's come in a 5'10 body has made it possible for Kemp to buffalo his way through the minors in a way that a smaller and obviously weaker man can't, without refining his tools.  (The 6'4 Jeff Francouer buffaloed his way to the majors quickly the same way, despite the fact that his baseball skills are still raw.)  Also, Kemp's being a right-handed hitter has meant he has not had to worry about the handicap that so many young left-handed hitters face because they are just not used to batting against same-handed pitchers.

I hope I have answered your question about Paul to your satisfaction, if not persuaded you of his merits.  I won't be surprised if Paul doesn't make it to the majors, as guys who rank #19 in a particular system usually don't.  But I do see some potential for an MLB career there, possibly as the lefty side of a platoon, and very likely for a smaller market team than the Dodgers.

by CanuckDodger on Dec 19, 2006 2:07 AM PST up reply actions  

Bastardo
Yeah, I read your explanation, but: you slotted Bastardo at thirty just to spite me, right?

by Andrew Shimmin on Dec 18, 2006 9:51 PM PST up reply actions  

The Bastard
Sorry to disappoint you, Andrew, but I made my list quite a while ago, and while I have revised the list a few times since the end of the minor league season, because of new information or just changes of mind, Bastardo has been #30 for a while. He had a good K rate, but a few more walks than you want from a 22-year-old in high A. He is also short for a pitcher.  But like I said, he places where he does because of how much I DON'T know about him.  I am open to the possibility that he should rank higher, depending on what we eventually learn about his stuff.  I am hoping Bastardo makes the next Baseball America Prospect Handbook, and I plan to ask the BA writer a question about him in the "chat" that will be done for the Dodgers' farm system in mid-February.  If Bastardo's fastball stays in the 90's over multiple innings and he has a good breaking ball, I will like him a lot more than I will if I find out he is just a soft-tosser who has been fooling Single A hitters.  At any rate, like you I LOVE his name, so I will root for him to make the majors as a Dodger even if he IS a soft-tosser, but his chances of ever being a Dodger are going to go down tremendously if he is a finesse pitcher and not a power guy.

by CanuckDodger on Dec 19, 2006 2:50 AM PST up reply actions  

My name. . .
is Alberto Bastardo. You killed my father (who wasn't married to my mother). Prepare to die.

by Andrew Shimmin on Dec 19, 2006 9:43 AM PST up reply actions  

I have no idea what I'm doing
Most of this is based on what I've read through scouting reports and just commentary from other people who know more about our farm system than I do.  I only know of a few stats that correlate well with getting to the majors.
  1. Scott Elbert
  2. James Loney
  3. Andy LaRoche
  4. Clayton Kershaw
  5. Greg Miller
  6. Blake DeWitt
  7. Jonathan Meloan
  8. Justin Orenduff
  9. Tony Abreu
  10. Preston Mattingly
I rate Loney higher than most, but I'm pretty high on him, and I rate him this high in that if he can develop significant power, I think he'll be a great major leaguer.  That is, of course, if Ned Colletti ever gives him a spot to play.

by Rich @ True Blue LA on Dec 18, 2006 8:22 PM PST reply actions  

Reader Participation
My top thirty
  1. Andy LaRoche
  2. Clayton Kershaw
  3. Scott Eldred
  4. James Loney
  5. Greg Miller
  6. Jonathan Meloan
  7. Blake DeWitt
  8. Tony Abreu
  9. Josh Bell
  10. Bryan Morris
  11. Preston Mattingly
  12. Ivan DeJesus
  13. Mike Megrew
  14. Bridger Hunt
  15. Jesus Castillo
  16. Stephen Johnson
  17. Chin Lung Hu
  18. Zach Hammes
  19. Xavier Paul
  20. Wesley Wright
  21. Cory Dunlap
  22. Lucas May
  23. Javy Guerra
  24. Josh Wall
  25. Russell Mitchell
  26. Casey Hoorelbeke
  27. Justin Orenduff
  28. Ryan Rogowski
  29. Tony Harper
  30. Ramon Paredes

by grabarkewitz on Dec 18, 2006 9:07 PM PST reply actions  

Preston Mattingly?
Why he so highly rated?  He was just drafted and didn't hit much.  I understand he is a fine athlete but he isn't he a bit of an unknown at this point?

by robohobo on Dec 19, 2006 4:41 PM PST reply actions  

Quite So
I can't say I understand it either, but scouts love the guy, so I have to give him his due.

by Andrew on Dec 19, 2006 4:47 PM PST up reply actions  

He probably gets props
because Logan White drafted him so high. I imagine that Logan has that much respect in the scouting world.

by robohobo on Dec 19, 2006 4:57 PM PST reply actions  

Maybe
You can't always expect a raw player like Mattingly to tear it up immediately. In Kemp's first season of pro ball he only hit .270/.298/.346, with only a slightly better strikeout rate than Mattingly, and look where he is now.

by Andrew on Dec 19, 2006 5:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Kemp and Mattingly
I think Logan White very much had Kemp in mind when he drafted Mattingly.  The similarities at age 18 are very significant:  big and strong athletes very fast for their size, and more noted as high school basketball players than baseball players.  White must have thought that if Kemp worked out really well, why not try and duplicate the success by procuring a very similar athlete?  I guess what some people would question is using a first supplemental pick and a $1 million signing bonus on this kind of player.  Matt Kemp was a 6th rounder who received a $150,000 signing bonus.  If Kemp had flopped, people would say White took a risk in the 6th round and not much was lost with the failure of the pick, because few 6th rounders ever make the majors anyway.

At any rate, Mattingly definitely qualifies as a "high risk, high reward" prospect, and if in ranking prospects "potential" is an important criterion for you, then Mattingly certainly deserves a high ranking.  But if in making rankings of Dodger prospects you regard "proven production" and "closeness to the majors" as more important than potential, then you are not going to be that big on Mattingly -- at least yet.

by CanuckDodger on Dec 19, 2006 6:23 PM PST up reply actions  

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2012 Dodgers Payroll

Italics denote estimates
Pos No Player 2012 Salary
C 17 Ellis $500,000 team control
1B 7 Loney $6,375,000
2B 14 Ellis $2,500,000
3B 5 Uribe $8,000,000
SS 9 Gordon $485,000 team control
LF 21 Rivera $4,000,000
CF 27 Kemp $10,000,000
RF 16 Ethier $10,950,000

IF/OF 6 Hairston $2,250,000
OF 10 Gwynn $850,000
2B/3B 3 Kennedy $800,000
C 18 Treanor $850,000
IF 12 Sellers $485,000 team control

SP 22 Kershaw $6,000,000
SP 58 Billingsley $9,000,000
SP 29 Lilly $12,000,000
SP 35 Capuano $3,000,000
SP 44
Harang $3,000,000

CL 54 Guerra $485,000 team control
RHP 74
Jansen $500,000 team control
RHP 55 Guerrier $4,750,000
RHP 60 Coffey $1,000,000
RHP 66 MacDougal $650,000
LHP 57 Elbert $485,000 team control
RHP 36
Hawksworth $500,000 team control

TJ 41 De La Rosa $485,000 team control



Manny $8,087,432 deferred


Andruw $3,375,000 deferred


Pierre $3,050,000 deferred
Furcal $3,000,000 deferred
Kuroda $2,000,000 deferred
Garland $1,500,000 option buyout
Blake $1,250,000 option buyout

Totals
$112,162,432

For more detailed information, click here.

Players on 40-man roster used as roster
fillers until moves are made.

Current 40-man roster count: 40
(not including Belisario)

2012 Non-Roster Invitees

No Player Age*
63 Jose Ascanio rhp
27
61 Alberto Castillo lhp
36
56 Matt Chico lhp
29
33 John Grabow lhp
33
59 Angel Guzman rhp
30
47 Wil Ledezma lhp
31
72 Shane Lindsay rhp
27
62 Fernando Nieve rhp 29
73 Scott Rice lhp 30
70 Will Savage rhp
27
71 Ryan Tucker rhp
25
28 Jamey Wright rhp
37

30 Josh Bard c 34
82 Griff Erickson c 24
81 Matt Wallachc 26
67 Jeff Baisley 3b/1b 29
65 Luis Cruz ss/2b 28
37 Josh Fields 3b 29
64 Lance Zawadzki if 27
56 Cory Sullivan of 32

*Age on June 30, 2012

NRI count: 20

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