My Morals Are Better Than Yours
I've tried to avoid writing about steroids over the last year or so because it brings out the trait I hate most about sports writers. The self righteous "my morals are better than yours, and I'm the only person keeping baseball from becoming a cesspool" attitude. So, I'll try to keep this as objective as possible.
Mark McGwire getting only 23.5% of the votes for the Hall of Fame reveals what a joke this entire process is (crap, there went objectivity). It sets the incredibly dangerous precedent that if the BBWA decided that you used steroids, then you used steroids, and the Hall of Fame is not a place for you. The only signs we have of McGwire taking steroids is that Jose Canseco said he did, and that he's got some big-ol' muscles. Neither of which is exactly a smoking gun. McGwire has never tested positive for steroids, nor has he ever admitted to it.
The main thing that's brought up in regards to McGwire and steroids is his "I'm not here to talk about the past" speech. Now, it seems to me he was in a no win situation here. He says that he was on the juice, then there's no way he gets into the Hall (unless writers are even more hypocritical than I assume they are). If he says no, then we just call him a liar, and he's in the same situation. Which would you rather happen if you were McGwire? Would you rather he go through the "I never took steroids, period" speech that Palmiero went through? Maybe, we feel for that one hook, line, and sinker so maybe McGwire would be getting inducted with Ripken and Gwynn if he would have just done that. It seems like pleading the 5th was the best thing McGwire could have done if he actually was roided.
Now, I'm not naive. I believe Mark McGwire was on steroids, along with Sammy Sosa, Brett Boone, and several others, but I have no proof of this, so I can't hold it against them. You want to bring up steroids when Barry Bonds, Gary Sheffield, or Alex Sanchez are going to be elected, that's fine, but keeping someone out of the Hall without any actual evidence is a very dangerous game.
What's also odd is how we decided who's a roider. Haven't we learned from people like Alex Sanchez, Mike Morse and Jason Grimsley that you don't have to be a big guy to be roided? Why don't we automatically assume Roger Clemens is on something, his career took a sudden turn for the better at age 40? How about Mike Piazza, he went from a man drafted as a favor to the best offensive catcher of all time, must have had some assistance somewhere. Cal Ripken Jr? No one can could play 2600 games without some form of assistance. How come when Ryan Howard hits 58 home runs we automatically assume he's clean? Why is Davey Johnson's sudden jump from five home runs to 43 in 1973 not more closely scrutinized? I don't believe these arguments, but the point is that anyone can be roided, and in almost every player's career you can find a point where you can say "yeah, he was probably on the juice." Why don't we give these players the same treatment. Steroids are a sad part of baseball's history, but guessing about who was on the juice when and destroying legacies is far more detrimental to the game than a vote for Mark McGwire ever could be.
Oh yeah, Bert Blyleven losing votes this year is a travesty, but I've given up that fight.
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22 comments
Comments
speed
by soundchaser on Jan 9, 2007 3:14 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
McRoids
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 9, 2007 3:44 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Grimsleys matter. . .
Grimsleys also indicate that steroids might not be magic. That bad players on 'roids are still bad. We have no rational basis for guessing how big a part steroids played in Big Mac's 70 HR season. Or his career. There's no conversion algorithm.
Are sportswriters really that good at guessing? They're not, on the whole, all that good at discerning things that are obviously true. But guessing is their strong suit?
It's a dodge to say none of it matters. If you don't care, so be it, but that's not an argument.
by Andrew Shimmin on Jan 9, 2007 4:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
McGrimsley
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 9, 2007 4:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re
If you are assuming that McGwire is just going to be locked out for one year, then this is fine, just kind of pointless. I'm working on the assumption that he wouldn't get in, which I guess is a bit presumptous of me after going off on a rant about guessing.
I'm just operating on a innocent until proven guilty principle. I do believe that McGwire used steroids, but I have absolutely nothing to back this up. If I can't back up the claim, I can't hold it against him.
by Andrew on Jan 9, 2007 4:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
More from the other Andrew--
And what difference does it make that the BBWAAers aren't jurors? Who said that beyond a reasonable doubt was the only acceptable standard? This is what I meant, calling indifference a dodge. Just because this isn't a capital murder case, doesn't mean we should ignore every precept of fair play. When I play chess with my computer, I don't capture its queen with my pawn on the first move, just because the game is inconsequential. What's the point of doing anything that way?
I'm saying: you want to have a rule that steroid users don't get in (or don't get in till they've done their time in purgatory), fine. I'd rather you didn't, but fine. But if you're going to have the rule, you'd better bloody well have a way of telling steroid users from non-steroid users. Because, if you haven't, you've turned the whole thing into one more iteration of clutchiness, and scrappiosity; made up excuses for liking some players, disliking others, and feeling oh-so-good about yourself, in the bargain.
It's indecent to hold Mark McGwire to a different standard than other players, not because he's such a great guy, but because it just inherently is. Which is not to say it's a travesty. Like I said, I haven't decided whether I care about this, yet. But it is indecent.
by Andrew Shimmin on Jan 9, 2007 5:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ummmmmm...
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 9, 2007 10:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I understood
I thought your arguments made sense. I just disagreed with them.
by The Other Andrew on Jan 9, 2007 11:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
re: Andrew
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 9, 2007 5:01 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
not too mention
Also agree with you about Blyleven. I think that actually irritates me more. Random (and likely fleeting) moralism, though wrong, is commonplace in all maters political. I can't really hold the BWWAA accountable for being as pandering as most other politicos. Blylevn makes it clear that they just don't know what they are doing when it comes to the one thing at which they are proportedly experts.
by Paul Scott on Jan 9, 2007 6:31 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Xeifrank
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 9, 2007 8:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Why does Baseball need a rule against
by The Other Andrew on Jan 9, 2007 9:09 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Dreifort
I think he was on them.
It's ashame he was so brittle.
by rayg on Jan 9, 2007 7:41 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
evidence
There is certainly EVIDENCE McGwire took steroids. Canseco's stories are evidence. Perhaps not credible evidence, but evidence nonetheless.
Similarly, while 'taking the fifth' could not be considered evidence in a court of law, it can certainly be evidence in a non-legal proceeding.
For example, if you suspected an employee of stealing, and questioned him about it, and he said "I invoke my right against self-incrimination", wouldn't you think that meant he DID steal? You would probably fire him if you were the boss.
So using McGwire's Congressional non-testimony as evidence that he used steroids is entirely appropriate, in my view, for HOF voters.
That does not answer the question of whether they have enough evidence to keep him out, or whether even proof positive evidence (confession, dirty test) SHOULD keep him out. But there is some evidence McGwire used steroids, and that, I venture, is why Andrew believes McGwire used.
So all this just to say that there is a difference between evidence and proof, and saying there is no evidence McGwire used steroids is inaccurate.
by Alfredo Griffin on Jan 10, 2007 9:38 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
McGwire
by bobmac on Jan 10, 2007 8:23 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
re: McGwire
vr, Xei
by xeifrank on Jan 11, 2007 11:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Everyone's on 'Roids!
We're never going to throw out all the guys in the HOF who did illegal activities; this was acceptable behavior at the time, so let's just all shut up and enjoy the game and the players. Nobody ever went from a no-talent hack to good player by taking steroids, HGH, cocaine, amphetamines, whatever.
by isednom on Jan 11, 2007 8:37 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Andrew: great post
by 1958 on Jan 11, 2007 9:24 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Reporters in Locker Rooms, et al
For another angle, I read Tom Verducci's article and the article is imho good reporting.
"Searching for truth" by Tom Verducci of SI.com,
but I read the article on yahoo sports.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=cnnsi-searchingfortru&prov=cnnsi&type=lgns
by cb504 on Jan 11, 2007 11:20 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re
by Andrew on Jan 11, 2007 3:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yep that makes sense
There are two main issues at work: the media members don't want to get duped again (or give the appearance thereof) and McGwire is THE only person who hanged himself in this whole mess that is up for the HOF.
At least there is a significant minority of the electorate that sees through the BS and still cast their votes for McGwire.
by isednom on Jan 11, 2007 11:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

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