Bargain Hunting Dodger Style
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 9:45 AM PST
572 comments
MLBTR has updated their 2010 Free Agent List with the recent non - tenders who have not signed. Not surprisingly the Dodgers do not appear tied to anyone at the moment. Over a month ago we looked at the 2010 Free Agent class not really knowing what direction the Dodgers would be going in. Now I'd say we know they are not spending much money and how much may depend on how or if they are able to move Pierre. It will be bargain basement hunting. Some of those Free Agents in Nov are now gone but the list has been padded with many non - tenders from Saturday. That is not to say the list has been added with very much talent. There is usually a good reason why someone has been non - tendered, however some players look interesting. Kelly Johnson for sure but I doubt we can afford him or even if Ned is interested.
So which of those names can the Dodgers afford now, or will some of them be available come Feb when they become desperate to find a team?
Wang has been mentioned because of Torre but I've yet to see an ex-Yankee show up on in the Dodger clubhouse so that relationship seems over used whenever a Yankee appears available. They couldn't get rid of Procter fast enough.
Our roster needs are minimal in the key positions other then 2nd base and a starting pitcher. We need a backup catcher and there are plenty of candidates there besides our own AJ Ellis. 2nd base is where the Dodger action will be focused. Maybe a utility infielder who is better than Hu. That should not be hard to find. A bat off the bench to replace Mientkiewicz or it may be Mientkiewicz again. If Pierre is dealt then a back up outfielder better than Repko or Paul.
Pitchers galore but are the ones we can afford any better then the in house options? To be honest I don't know what the price of Padilla is, but if we can get him for $4 Million on a one year deal I'd be all over that. Eric rightly said the Dodgers should run away from Padillia but he did add at the end of that article:
Unless the offer is a one-year contract for a few million bucks, perhaps with some incentives built in, the Dodgers should stay away from the Vicente Padilla sweepstakes. Otherwise, he is a bad gamble.
Back then (a month ago) we didn't know how much the Dodgers needed to gamble. Given the alternatives it might be the best gamble if the price is right. I'll probably find that someone just offered him $10 Million after saying we should do $4 Million but at $4 Million do you think it would be a bad gamble? No health issues, plenty of innings, and we all look better when standing next to him.
We don't need any rants about how McCourt sucks because we are bargain hunting. Work with what we have not with what we'd like to have if our budget was 2008 not 2009.
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I like Gomes, Garko, Thames, and Johnson. I think all could be had for $2 million or less. Garko is the least useful since he can only play 1B. Gomes is a butcher in the OF, but is the best hitter of the bunch.
I would imagine Gomes would be able to sign for more than $2m, but that’s just a guess as there aren’t a lot of recent comps for that kind of player. If he’s available at that price he makes a lot of sense for the Dodgers if they move Pierre.
If they can’t move Pierre, then Johnson makes sense because he can also play the corner OF spots. If he can rebound to his numbers of 2 years ago, a combo of DeWitt and Johnson add some good flexibility as Casey Blake can also play LF (DeWitt to 3B, Johnson at 2B).
Lackey likely to Red Sox
Per Ed Price and later confirmed by Ken Rosenthal. From Rosenthal:
Lackey taking physical with #RedSox; story by Fanhouse’s Ed Price confirmed. Deal likely similar to Burnett’s.
Poor Toronto
Jordan Bastain of MLB.com sums up the Blue Jays’ plight:
AJ Burnett all over again? If Boston signs Lackey, Jays would get a second round pick for Scutaro — not a first round pick
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions
That so sucks
I’m never counting draft pick chicks until they hatch.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:16 AM PST up reply actions
My heart doesn't bleed for Toronto
An 86 OPS+ guy becomes Type-A after a single 111 OPS+ season. Toronto is lucky that he is Type-A at all and should be glad there is anything more than the supplemental pick for him. This is not like Toronto getting screwed on Burnett’s comp – he is more like a “true” Type-A guy, and they were jobbed all the way down to a #3 pick because he ranked behind both Teixeira and Sabathia.
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
That is awesome
I’d love the Clippers to do something like that. You could easily handle the fact they are standing the whole game by putting them in rows 15 -20 with 20 being the last row of the lower section, right behind the basket seats 1 -15. 75 free seats, goto every game, cheer your ass off. Cheering is contagious. Clipper Daryl can be the orchestrator.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:31 AM PST up reply actions
Speaking of Pierre
(And sorry if was mentioned yesterday but) this piece in the Chicago Sun Times on Juan Pierre still being of interest to the White Sox had one part that made little sense to me.
If the Sox land Pierre — who is more than on the radar — they would make sure the Dodgers are on the hook for a good portion of what Pierre is owed.
In return, Los Angeles is rumored to not be asking much to get rid of a player they don’t have playing time for.
Now how would that work for the Dodgers? They wouldn’t shed much salary in this proposed idea, and wouldn’t get much in return (as far as players). I realize getting Pierre out of LA in a way that greatly benefits the Dodgers isn’t easy to accomplish, but the way he lays it out makes even less sense for LA. Am I missing something?
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
The only way something like that would happen is if the Dodgers are even more up against the limit of their budget than previously thought. For instance, if they absolutely have to save $4m or something, and there is a limited market for Pierre, than they might trade him for a nothing prospect and still pay $10m or so of his salary (of the $18.5m remaining).
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 10:13 AM PST up reply actions
That is scary, but here's what I don't get
If the Dodgers are truly that close to their margins, wouldn’t they be looking at Manny’s pay and wondering if there’s an AL team that wants him to DH? That’s a big chunk of change that Colletti would love to put elsewhere, no?
I don’t think Manny is about to be traded or should be traded. Just saying if the margins were that tight, why would they be looking to scrape together pennies on Pierre’s dollar instead of moving a player with value in the other league?
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 10:18 AM PST up reply actions
It’s a combo of not much of a market for Manny (teams still turned off by him), and that Manny is significantly better than Pierre. Pierre is the perfect storm of being (1) an extra player (non-starter), (2) that teams actually might want to have, and (3) has a salary large enough to want to dump
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions
They are waiting until the trade deadline to trade Manny
after everyone has bought their tickets already.
I would not be surprised
if they have not looked at trading Manny. If they trade Manny instead of Pierre you can bet the expectations will change plenty for 2010. It would be easier to do for them from a PR point of view now that Manny is no longer the Manny of Aug/Sept 2009 but a mere mortal. Remember Ned has a knack of pulling deals that MLBTR had no clue we were in on.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:28 AM PST up reply actions
Manny is still very popular. If he isn’t hitting that could change, but if he is people will pillory McCourt for trading him and I bet even post-suspension they made a lot of $$$ on Manny products.
Manny's money is deferred, right?
If they need to save cash, isn’t more cash actually going to Pierre in 2010?
by MattBakerJr on Dec 14, 2009 11:29 AM PST up reply actions
Both Manny and Pierre will make $10m in 2010
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
But $5 million of the $10 that Manny will make is 2010 salary, which the Dodgers wouldn't pay if they traded him.
Pierre is due $10 M in ’10 and $8.5 M in ’11.
If Manny is not traded….
In ’10, Manny gets $5M from his ’09 salary plus $5 M from his ’10 salary = $10 M
In ’11, ’12, and ’13, Manny will get $8.33333 M.
If Manny is traded, he would get $5 M each year from the Dodgers in ’10 through ’12.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
Nope
deferrals don’t start until 2011.
http://www.truebluela.com/2009/1/14/720656/dodger-payroll#manny
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:37 AM PST up reply actions
Ah, read Cot's wrong.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 11:54 AM PST up reply actions
Cot’s has different info, which is a contradictory. I will do some more digging.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
unfortunately, I think we've past the "even more up against the limit of their budget than previously thought" stage a while ago
I have NO interest in moving Pierre if we can’t get something of equal or greater value in return- which you know we won’t get. BUT…if the Dodgers really are committed to keeping everyone else around for 2009, and the budget is so tight that they can’t even afford extra DRAFT picks, we have to brace ourselves for (at least) one more outrage this off-season, and moving Pierre to save a few bucks seems to be a possibility. Besides- and this is TOTAL speculation- but maybe the Dodgers & White Sox have an understanding, after they gave us Thome for virtually nothing.
The Thome deal has nothing to do with it IMO. What the White Sox got out of the Thome trade was $1 million of salary relief.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
yeah, I figured it was something like that
of all the issues with this, I figured that’d be the least probable to have anything to do with any of this, but I figured I’d just throw it out there. :/
Makes sense for me
I always thought they would simply move him for salary relief not for another bad contract. Eating 10 Mill of 20Mill still saves you 10 Mill and instead of taking on a bad contract of a pitcher you can sign someone for the same production for 2 – 3 Mill.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:18 AM PST up reply actions
I guess that's what he means
if it’s saving 10 million of the 20, then it somewhat makes sense. The way he wrote it makes it sound like the Dodgers would eat much more of that, however which makes considerably less sense unless, as Eric says above, they are even more desperate than thought and even saving 2-3 million will keep them afloat. Hope not.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Also
what if the Dodgers included some bullpen help (not suggesting Bellisario or Kuo but someone else decent but expendable) to help the White Sox in another area of need in exchange for a slightly better player. Then ChiSox split the 20 m owed Pierre.
Dodgers maybe get a useful backup catcher, infielder or pitching depth.
PS: Pierre and Andruw Jones, reunited again! Buahahaha! Oh man, I’d feel a bit bad for Juan…
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
The question then would be where that money would go
I think the answer would be its already spent, but then again, maybe that’s the free agent budget.
I think you're right
that it is already spent. I just have this feeling that any salary relief we do get from trading anyone, would not be reinvested back into the team other than maybe a little for a couple min salary replacements.
by CarolinaDodger on Dec 14, 2009 10:38 AM PST up reply actions
That's the exact scenario I specualted before
It the Juan Pierre 50% off SALE!
Think of it basically as Chicago “signs” Pierre in 2010 prices and dollars to a two year contract.
Instead of signing its a “trade” where the Dodgers give Pierre and a bag of cash (deferred of coarse) in exchange for Chicago taking the contract and a backup backup backup backup 2nd baseman.
Beimel
must be recoiling with the thought this dude is his biggest fan.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
Troy's mom is proud though
(Wire image of her at work)
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
I still remember recoiling and shouting in horror in the theater at the “hobbling” scene.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:02 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah
once you read the book you were prepared. I used to read alot of Stephen King but then he kept writing and I stopped reading. I think the Gunslinger series was the last I read and I’m fairly sure I only got halfway.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah
I don’t know anything about it, but that seems like something out of the “Stranger”. Troy acts a little crazy and was that why he is going to jail?
I really doubt anybody else would have gotten that sentence for that (or even prosecuted).
Holding his 6 year old
upside down by his feet is pretty disgusting.
by robotmadeofnails on Dec 14, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
Are the players we are looking at in the "bargain basement"
any better than the one’s we have now?
The only player I can really see as necessary to sign from outside would be backup catcher (which coincidentally is the only position Ned has confirmed he is going after). I wouldn’t argue with signing someone like Bellie to play 2nd with Dewitt, but if I were operating with Ned’s constraints I would be thinking two things:
1. If I have any money to sign anybody it needs to be for starting pitching before has-been washed-up infielders or a big bat off the bench..
2. If I can’t sign any starting pitching, this club isn’t going to seriously compete, so making them marginally better doesn’t help much. If by some miracle, ALL the kids have a great jump this year, and the starting rotation comes together like the pen did last year, I can bring in some vets short term by taking some salary at the trade deadline if F McC let’s me.
It is very possible that none of the available players are any better then what we currently have and that might even include the starting pitching that we can afford. I’m not ready to agree with this
If I can’t sign any starting pitching, this club isn’t going to seriously compete,
unless you mean compete against the Yankee’s, who the last I looked won a world championship with questionable bodies handling the four and five rotation spots.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
It depends on the trade market for Pierre
if they can get a starting pitcher for Pierre, or free up enough to acquire a 4th starter by trading Pierre, then they money still should be there to sign one of the non-tenders.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
From Rosenthal:
Jamey Carroll deciding between multiple two-year offers. LAA, OAK, LAD all have shown interest
Jamey Carroll as backup: fine, whatever.
Jamey Carroll as starter: hulk smash.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, it's a big difference
because as a backup, I really like him, he’d be like Mark Loretta except (imho) much better. He’s solid. He’s versatile enough.
As a full-time starter… not so thrilled.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
For a right handed hitter
Carrol is a very little split differential. If we are going for a backup infielder or someone to share time with DeWitt I’d rather have that person at least whack LHP to a decent tune. Carroll is not that guy. Belliard is. Against RHP it is a toss up but against LHP Belliard is like Minny Manny compared to Carroll.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
by Phil Gurnee on Dec 14, 2009 11:07 AM PST up reply actions
Isn't Carroll a better fielder than
Belliard though? fwiw…
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Speaking of middle infielders
Counsell is officially back with Milwaukee (one year)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 10:58 AM PST up reply actions
Two years?!
A bench 2B-3B, career 83 OPS+ who will be 36 right around the start of Spring Training. Really?
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Baseball HQ Scouting reports on Carlos Monasterios
LA DODGERS – Carlos Monasterios (RHP, from Philadelphia via NY Mets): The 24 year-old had his best year as a pro in ‘09 as he lowered his oppBA while flashing a higher K rate. He went 5-6 with a 3.73 ERA, 2.9 CTL and 7.6 DOM between High-A and Double-A. Monasterios has a loose arm that generates good velocity for a sinkerballer. He normally sits in the 87-91 MPH range, but he can jack up his heater to 92-93 MPH if necessary. He’ll induce his fair share of groundballs from the movement on his pitches. Much of his success in ‘09 can be attributed to better fastball command, but his breaking balls are still works in progress. His changeup shows potential, but isn’t yet reliable.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
FYI, Randy Wolf contract details
per SI:
2010: $9.25m
2011: $9.5m
2012: $9.5m
2013: $10m option ($1.5m buyout)
3 years, $29.75m guaranteed
Roger, Roger. What's our vector, Victor?
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
February is generally pretty bleak too
Post-NFL, NBA midseason, before baseball starts, generally empty and boring.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
There is no 3rd season. Announced last week. They are done. :(
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
LOL I thought the same thing
We both thought he meant Fl of the Conchords.
I will miss them much more than that boxing match.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Best news of the day for me
I am psyched!
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions
Hideki Matsui
from Buster Olney:
Heard this: Hideki Matsui’s one-year deal with the Angels is for about $6.5 million
Crap
Apparently Halladay and his agents are in Philadelphia today, and not to see the 76ers.
John Paul Morosi (serial killer name) of Fox Sports:
The Halladay talks are at a crucial point and could be resolved within the next couple days
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 11:55 AM PST up reply actions
Whatever happened to Chivalry?
The Phils should start cutting some of their best players to go down to the Dodgers level, not get better :)
We should actively pursue Cliff Lee
not sure why they’re in a hurry to move him, but grab him.
The Phillies may be willing to move Lee, but until I see rumors to the contrary, I won’t believe that (a) they’d be willing to move him to their chief rival for the NL pennant or (b) the Dodgers would be willing to pay for Lee’s salary.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
I'll give you (b)
but they’re too good an organization to care about (a). that’s for losers like Riccardi to pull. You make the best deal you make, who cares about who you are dealing with.
Well, that's true
but only up to a point, isn’t it?
Let’s take a ridiculous example first: if the Dodgers offer up the farm for Lee, but get only reasonable deals from other teams, then of course they give Lee to the Dodgers.
But more realistically, all of the teams offering deals for Lee will put up roughly similar packages, I think. Even if the Dodgers’ best offer is a little better than those of the other teams, would the fact that the Phillies have a window to win another championship or two mean they take a little hit and not face Lee in this coming postseason?
It’s not that there’s a blanket no-trading-with-the-Dodgers; it’s that the fact that you might face the Dodgers (and Lee) in Game 7 of the NLCS is one of the many things you have to consider.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe. I mean, how far do you take that philosophy though – to every team in your division, plus contenders? That then eliminates LA, Colorado, SF, Chicago, St. Louis, and then maybe every good AL team since they could meet in the WS?
At that point, your aren’t dealing with too many good teams who are going to be looking for Lee. I can’t see the Reds or San Diego going after him.
Plus if you are the Phillies, you are the best team in the league, you’ve beaten LA two years in a row, you are about to add Halladay, and you know what’s going on with LA’s ownership situation. If I’m them, and I can improve, I do it. I wouldn’t be too concerned with what other teams do.
Fair enough.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 12:39 PM PST up reply actions
I don't see the point for the Phils
I guess it depends on the prospects, but I think I might just stick with Lee as opposed to giving him up plus top prospects for Halladay.
$$$
Their core is pretty expensive and I don’t think they can afford both.
…and having a pitcher for a longer window than one year, as they probably still have a good 2-3 year window of contention.
Maybe Lee balked at a contract extension or something.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
But wouldn’t it make more sense for them to have him for this year and then to offer arb?
by robotmadeofnails on Dec 14, 2009 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
I guess that’s what they have to weigh.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
I wonder
if Rowand wishes he had given them a discount? :)
by robotmadeofnails on Dec 14, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
I'm glad he didn't
considering where he wound up and for how much
Lee is NOT the guy you want to break the bank for in terms of money or prospects. Not when there’s going to be a once in a generation superstar pitcher available within 7-24 months (King Felix).
Yeah, but he'd never sign in Philly
I don’t see how they’d afford him – he’ll either stay in Seattle or take like $180 mil from NY or Boston.
I’m hearing 200M plus.
Securing his age 26-29 seasons should make him worth the price.
by silverwidow on Dec 14, 2009 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
Felix
I don’t see him signing an 8-year deal though, which is what would have to happen to top $200m. Better for him to sign a shorter deal (~5 years) then hit the market at a still-young enough age to sign another deal. Better for the signing club because who wants to give any pitcher 8 years?
It would pretty much have to be the Yankees to even get close. He would probably top out at 7/$175m.
Also, if Felix is “once in a generation,” what is Mr. 400 K, chopped liver? :)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
You know how much I dig Kershaw, but he wasn’t shutting down High A/AA (in extremely tough pitching environments, I might add) at 18 y.o. like King Felix. Then the next year, at 19, he somehow put together a 2.25 ERA in the PCL with a 10.2 K/9.
That’s once in a generation shit. :)
Mr. 400 K is Strasburg though, not Kershaw.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:08 PM PST up reply actions
As pointed out though, it's a moot point
We’re not going after anyone of Lee’s talent due to the $$$ aspects of it.
At this point, I’d settle for Bedard or Wang.
I like how the Halladay news breaks
as i see on Twitter and right alongside it is Diamond Leung’s little post about how the Dodgers re-signed John Lindsay to another minor league contract.
Not that I make any correlation between the two but it did make me laugh knowing some D fans will invariably go “The Phillies get Halladay and we do this chopped liver signing!? I’m aghast!”
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
John Lindsay!
I’ve always liked him, and he’s put up good numbers in AA and AAA. Give him a shot at 1b! :P
Done deal
per Rosenthal.
Not sure if Halladay’s extension is a contingency of the trade though.
Heck of an offseason for the Mariners.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions
“Not only did the Phillies go out and get an ace while the Dodgers stood pat, they went out and got both of them!”
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:11 PM PST up reply actions
Bad link
sorry about that.
Here is the SI piece.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Wouldn’t it be crazy if Lee wasn’t the one going to the Mariners?
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:18 PM PST up reply actions
Heyman writes (emphasis mine):
The Mariners have been looking for an ace, and did just that in getting Lee, the 2008 AL Cy Young winner who emerged as the Phillies ace last year…
WTF is King Felix??? Even for super old-school guys, Felix Hernandez was last year’s AL Cy Young runner-up with 19 wins! What Seattle did is make their #2 one of the best in baseball by slotting Lee into that spot.
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
he meant..
they wanted an ace to give some protectin to king felix..
yeah
and that what i was trying to say lol
so
they are adding another ace since King Fleix doesnt exist
while we dont have the guts to even keep one of our top starters (Wolf)
fantastic…
Leave Chad Billingsley alone!!!
Ken Rosenthal comes out lookind and smelling like a rose
Floats a column about a seemingly far-fetched rumor, and within 48-72 hours it’s a done deal.
SEA/PHI prospects headed to Toronto could include:
Josh Fields (SEA)
Michael Taylor (PHI)
Carlos Truinfel (SEA)
Greg Halman (SEA)
Kyle Drabek (PHI) – unlikely
Domonic Brown (PHI) – unlikely
<blockquote# nyp_joelsherman
What if Sea took best of those #Mets prospects (Ezequiel Carera, Maikel Cleto) to get Lee, then #Phils used Carera/Cleto for Halladay? half a minute ago from web
- Joel Sherman nyp_joelsherman
Close eyes #Mets fans because remember traded many prospects to #Mariners for Putz, and got nothing from Putz (cont) …>
Philly's gotta give up more than 1 player in this deal
to Toronto. I’m guessing they send Happ as well as another prospect.
Why would Seattle be throwing in
any prospects? Wouldn’t it be a Lee/Doc straight up with the Phillies throwing the prospects to the BlueJays?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Seattle is throwing in the prospects to get Lee
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:23 PM PST up reply actions
Why can't we get Lee for free?
How about we throw in J Mac to top their offer of nothing?
Because of Halliday instead of Lee or simply because they were already the best team?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Already the best team.
But I like Doc better than Lee.
Having Doc or Lee
for a full year would have already been a bonus, making it Doc is even better. Still the pitching staff fails to scare me.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
So far:
Angels lose Figgins/Lackey
Dodges lose Wolf/Hudson
Mariners gain Figgins/Lee
At least our competition didn’t go all in like the Mariners did but this has not been a kind winter so far for the Los Angeles teams.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Don’t forget, the Angels signed Matsui though (small consolation)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
id rather have matsui tho.
vlad is not himself anymore..
I wouldn't
bet against him doing as well as Matsui in 2010. He’s older but the last time he was a free agent he was coming off an injury plagued back injury and that is why the Angels got him cheap enough. Just don’t see enough of an upgrade from Vlady to Matsui to think they really helped themselves. Brandon Wood best be ready and that would be the best thing to happen for the Angels.
Not having Lackey is going to take it’s toll. Remember they also are losing Escobar. That once great rotation is looking very shakey.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
weaver saunders sanatana
and kazmir..
what a top 4..
shakey?
Saunders
always looks like someone who could implode into a Washburn.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
hes a nice 4 starter behind those 3
and he finished the year great..
True
and if Kazmir can rebound it would still be good. I’ve overstated my “shaky” comment.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
I am fully prepared to be outraged at just how little Philadelphia ended up giving up in the way of prospects in this deal, and/or the prospects used by Seattle to get Lee.
I am also somewhat buoyed by the fact that, for 2010, the difference between Halladay and Lee isn’t that great, and it’s extremely unlikely Halladay 2010 (or anyone) will match Cliff Lee 2009 in the postseason.
While that’s true, think of how much went wrong for Philly? Hamels was bad (whether it was luck, etc.), the bullpen and Lidge were a disaster, and Rollins stunk.
And they still made the World Series.
Oh, they’re still the favorites. Don’t get me wrong.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:30 PM PST up reply actions
Hard to feel sorry for Philly
A few players having off years is to be expected.
The other side of the coin would be Werth, Ibanez, Happ, and post-season Lee. They also were pretty much fully healthy going into the playoffs.
by Capt Obvious on Dec 14, 2009 11:26 PM PST up reply actions
as far as I'm concerned, it's a downgrade for Philly
…simply because Lee is a better hitter than Halladay! :))
Even with swapping Lee out, how high is the Philly payroll?
It’s got to be up there. Still – an interesting move. Why not just send your own prospects over for Halladay, and really go for it now, and let Lee walk? Then you are the WS favorite.
I guess the counter is by doing it this way, assuming they don’t throw in too much, they basically let Lee walk and signed Doc as an FA.
Depending on Blanton, they will easily be in the $140m range
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions
A year ago I wondered why the Dodgers were not in on CC, seems like a different decade now.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
You know, maybe Fox ownership wasn’t so bad. Dan Evans was an okay GM for the most part, and they were investing in the farm system…
And yet
the McCourt years have been much more succesful.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:33 PM PST up reply actions
but
how much of that was from the foundation laid by Fox?
by CarolinaDodger on Dec 14, 2009 1:34 PM PST up reply actions
Very little
I thought we had been over this. Billingsley and Broxton are the only two above average players on the Dodgers from the Fox era.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Yeah,
I knew it was a trio, irritating day all around for me.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
rusel martin is a two time all star
by the age of 25 too..
Okay
so even conceding the point that alot of the talent came from the Fox years, having a cheapskate owner helps to get these guys on the field contributing. Throwing money away at high priced free agents and trading the farm for guys like Jarrod Washburn and all those good drafts are irrelevant. Maybe the McCourt success is because of being cheap, and developing players and actually letting them play is a model that should be replicated.
I’m oversimplifying a bit.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:51 PM PST up reply actions
The Phillies have a strong young core, and have also filled in the blanks with fairly expensive FAs, some who have worked out, others haven’t so much.
That's irrelevant
I’m comparing the inept Fox ownership with the cheap McCourt ownership.
Having someone competent and wealthy would obviously be better than both.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:54 PM PST up reply actions
Did you not see the$52 million deferred column below us? McCourt was just as likely to spend on crappy veterans as the Fox guys. Heck even more since Dan Evans wanted to build this team from the farm system.
Fox (and especially that spawn of Satan, Chase Carey) did their damage before Evans though, by trading Piazza, hiring Kevin Malone etc. Dan Evans was brought in later to try and right the ship (after Fox hired Bob Daly to run the Dodger business, I believe.)
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I miss Dan Evans
Very underrated GM. Fired by McCourt on day 1 of his ownership which never gets mentioned on Frank’s lists of heinous acts, like getting rid of Ross Porter and such.
Evans brought in Logan and Kim as well.
by Capt Obvious on Dec 14, 2009 11:31 PM PST up reply actions
Luck and coincidence IMO
Sans hiring Torre.
Drafted players during a previous regime got good. Bonds left, and the other teams in the division got bad.
I think everyone on here can agree that Halladay is better than Lee
but considering the way Lee pitched in the postseason, I don’t really think Halladay makes them any better than they were last year once the playoffs start. They might be better over the course of the season, but how could they be much better come playoffs. Lee was lights out…
But being better over the course of the season
will be important with the Braves backing at their heals.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
i bet phllies
are going to be chasing the braves…
braves pitching is crazy
Braves pitching is crazy
but they need SOME sort of offense, unless they are assuming that Jason Heyward is guaranteed to have a Ryan Braun/Evan Longoria/Albert Pujols rookie year.
yeah ur right
escobar chipper mccann prado mclouth heyward laroche is not enough tho.. they are solid 1-8 and if they get a good LF then they are dynamite
Last I looked
LaRoche was a free agent or did the Braves sign him?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
They don’t even have LaRoche at this point, so they need a 1B and an OF, plus someone to back up Chipper because he is pretty brittle at this point.
Helps
to have the best hitting catcher in the NL, such a huge plus over the competition.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
and mclouth as your CF..
wow the braves have some great offense up the middle…
they just need some better offense from the corners..
they are almost the opposite of the dodgers..
i said almost the opposite..
matt kemp is the only exception
There's no reason to believe
that Lee would be lights out in the postseason again next year. You’re better off with the better pitcher (that’s Halladay) and hoping he gives you the lights out performance.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:34 PM PST up reply actions
I agree with you, but...
There’s also no past support that would suggest Halladay will be a lights out post season pitcher. I guess I’m just saying I don’t think it necessarily means the Phillies are destined for any more success next year than they had this year just by having Halladay, although I can understand why Philly would want him long term over Lee.
The postseason is a small sample size
taking an inferior pitcher based on four or five games which happen to be in October would be a mistake.
Take the better pitcher.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:39 PM PST up reply actions
Isn't Lee more durable than Halladay
too, though?
How much of the season will the Phils have Halladay’s services is one question, and if they don’t re-sign him they only get him for that period.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Halladay has more IP than anyone in baseball from 2006-2009.
Also, he has had more IP than Lee in each of the last two seasons, Lee’s bests.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah I don't know which butt I pulled that out from
must’ve been mine. ;-) I was thinking of last year, and thought Halladay had missed part of the season… Never mind.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Halladay was on the DL in June, but still ended up with a ton of IP
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:03 PM PST up reply actions
the man is almost a garanttee to go
7 inings..
Yep
he has led the majors in IP per start in each of the last three seasons. In 2006, he was “only” 5th, at 6.9
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:09 PM PST up reply actions
the mans a monster..
but all those innings are worrisome for his future..
how much longer can he handle all thesse innings?
Heyman
im being told #halladay will agree on deal with #phillies, which would finalize trade. but not likely to happen today
who from seattle is going to the blue jays?
morrow for sure
and ackley will probably be a ptbnl
because the mariners dont nearly have enough great [rps[ects//
Ackley is studly, and might be putting up Utley-like numbers and I believe he’s switched to second base this offseason.
Cliff Lee while being very good, possibly elite, is under contract for only one more year and who knows if he wants an extension or would like to go to Free Agency.
i see what you are saying..
but akley by himself will not get you Cliff lee..
ackley plus prospects will net you cliff lee..
ackely has yet to play any pro ball except the afl..
you never know what you will get..
lee is an Ace
I understand that
But I think Ackley will be a top 50 prospect already just from his college numbers, I might even suspect top 25. That’s without playing in the minors yet. I have very high expectations for Ackley, and I wouldn’t want to give him up for anyone unless they were named Felix, Greinke, Lincecum, Kershaw, Braun, Longoria, Pujols, or Utley. Pujols is the only exception for the contract status on here because it’s freakin Albert Pujols, lol.
he doesnt have the 30 homerun power of utley
more like 15-20..
and his D is a BIG ? mark
Are you kidding me? He was drafted as a 1st baseman.
How the heck gets drafted as a 1st baseman if they have no power?
please dont tell me this
wow..
come on..
he played first base cause he had tommy john surgery and could not throw..
hes a 2nd basemen CF or corner outfielder in the bigs..
You are underrating Ackley from what I am seeing
http://thebaseballcube.com/players/A/Dustin-Ackley.shtml
I’m not saying his numbers will translate to be exactly the same, but someone putting up those numbers wont just become a 15 homerun hitter in pro ball unless they just flop.
scouts say hes more of a line drive hitter..
then a guy who hits homers..
ok....
i never said he wasnt..
but this man is not chase utley like you said and he has yet to prove anything in the minors..
most to all gms would trade this guy for lee also..
but yeah he is a stud.. and a top 40 prospect in baseball..
Chase Utley is mostly a doubles hitter, but also plays in a
small park so he is able to hit for homeruns as well.
I’m not saying he is chase utley in the waiting, but at his ceiling could put up Utley-like offensive numbers.
Jim Bowden to the rescue!
Source: Toronto getting Phil Aumont and Dominic Brown in 3-way Halladay/Lee deal involving SEA/PHIL and TOR
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
second reaction: or are those just the highlighted ones?
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
aumont is a reliever..
brown is good tho
That makes sense
assuming Seattle is sending over more talent. Brown seems about what it would cost to go from Lee to Halladay.
yeah
seattle must be sendind another one or two of their top 5 prospects..
i would have said before lambos down year..
it would be Lambo and lindblom..
cause lindblom is in the same situation as aumont.. reliever who can be starters but are better as relievers.. in aumonts case he has a hip problem.. so yup..
There is no way in hell Ackley goes
He’s way too valuable to send for 1 year of Cliff Lee with no extension.
It needs to be said again
that while the Phillies appeared to have improved themselves the Dodgers were not sitting on their hands, they did resign John Lindsey to be their AAA first baseman.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
who was the triple AAA first basemen last year,,
i hope this doesnt blok edwardo from AA
No real set guy last year
they had a mish/mash of guys.
Val Pascucci had the most games at 1B, with 47. J.D. Closser was next at 36.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 1:49 PM PST up reply actions
As underdog said
at 1:04 but that’s okay, I know I comment in a vacuum, sniff {shuffle feet awkwardly} {reach for tissues} sniff… ;-)
Yes, the excitement of the Dodger offseason is the gift that keeps on giving. To us facetious types. ;-)
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
If Seattle can resign Branyan (and he can come close to replicating last season) and one more power hitter
They could be pretty damn good. They already had the best ERA in the AL last year and now they are adding Lee (basically replacing Washburn). Plus Figgins and Ichiro will really stir things up at the top of the lineup and Gutierrez looks like he is poised for a breakout
Somehow I’m glad Halliday is going to the Phil’s instead of the AL East. I’m tired of the talent drain from the NL.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
I'm just glad the Phills won't end up with Halladay AND Lee
That was my biggest fear, if they were willing to empty their farm.
In the end, Toronto decided
They would rather not pay Halladay anything for 2010 and they get two nice prospects that don’t cost them any bonus money.
The Mariners probably agreed to take on Lee’s whole salary so the Phillies were fine with that.
And the Phillies also took on Halladay’s whole salary
i think it also had to do with lee not signing an extension
while halladay is only coming to phillie if he gets an extension…?
Gotta wait
Still doesn’t really make sense yet.
If Lee + Brown = Halladay — ok, I’m with you so far — now Toronto has a great pitcher and a nice prospect. Could keep nice pitcher and get 2 picks next year… but instead…
…turn around and trade him, but only get aumont? That doesn’t make sense to me.
Have to wait.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 1:54 PM PST up reply actions
We don't yet know what Toronto got
but in the end do you think it will appear that if the Dodgers had the $$$, Halladay could’ve been theirs at a relatively reasonable cost of prospects?
Who knows
Other teams seem to ask more from Ned than anybody else.
The asking price would have been through the roof for the Dodgers.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 1:53 PM PST up reply actions
From a Seattle radio team (Brock & Salk):
Hearing if Aumont and Gillies are involved, then Moore and Morrow won’t be..
gillies is dee gordon 2.0
fast like crazy not really any power..plays position in the middle of the field..
they are exactly alike..
There's some speculation from the USS Mariner I guess
that it’s Hamels possibly, and not Lee. Can’t access the site though.
If it's Hamels
Whoa.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions
no wonder..
lee to halladay does not equal a prospect as good as domonic brown..
now hamels to halladay does..
The offseason is still young
But at this point, the Dodgers are gonna need tickets to watch postseason games
Remember this
The Dodgers won the most games in the NL without anyone having a particular great year (Ethier’s power notwithstanding). So as long as they can get some starters to fill out the rotation, they should have a shot in the NL West.
There were tons of guys who had great years
They just all sucked before so their great year was average.
I would still say Kemp and Bellisario had a great year. I hope they keep it up though.
Is there a point of watching if they have Lee and Doc
When our big acquisition this off-season will be resigning Belliard or Padilla?
For the Dodgers to compete with that staff Kershaw, Kemp, Ethier, and Broxton have to repeat their seasons, Bills has to pitch like first half, bullpen has to repeat results, Martin, Loney, and Furcal have to improve by a big amount.
Lets also not forget Manny has to play at least 140 games and put up a .900 + OPS (hopefully .950 or better).
Oye.
I don't follow
why do the Dodgers need to have those kind of seasons to compete with Philadelphia?
Philadelphia is not in the West, so to compete with Philadelphia the Dodgers need to a) get into the playoffs and b) play better than last year in the postseason.
Not sure what comparing with PHI in the regular season does.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 2:07 PM PST up reply actions
Was Philly in the west in 09? Or 08? We had to get through Philly to make the WS both years, and we failed badly both times. Sadly enough, the Dodgers are getting worse (or standing still) while the Phillies are improving.
I guess regular season numbers don’t matter in the case of playoff matchups, but I meant that more to the point of how good the player is for the year. If Martin, Loney, and Furcal have the same year in 2010 as 2009, do you think they will be a threat in the playoffs?
I think they'd be by far the best team in the league
But that guarantees you likely a really good regular season, and then an edge, but not a huge one in the postseason. In the NBA – you have the best team, you likely make the Finals. More of a crapshoot in baseball.
FWIW
Das411 posted on DT saying he’s not a fan of this trade and a lot of others aren’t either…
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
How can he be a fan
when we are not certain of the particulars?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Good question
maybe he’s buddies with Pat Gillick.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
And by Gillick
I mean R Amaro. frequently get those two mixed up.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
Seriously
That ad is in really heavy rotation. New Era is totally praying it’s Lee and not Hamels.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 1:59 PM PST up reply actions
I'm confused whose going where
If we yield now, all is over; but if we fight, there is yet a hope that we may stand upright
no one knows yet.
We don’t even know who the major participants are yet, aside from Halladay.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions
No
Teams don’t think that way. And the Phillies have already locked in a lot guys, they’ll wait to extend anyone they don’ have to .
locked in a lot of their guys- imagine that
and even BEFORE all this divorce stuff, we kept hearing, “Well which of the kids are you going to let go, because you can’t keep ALL of them!” Phills seem to have done ok in a smaller market, locking in Howard, Utley, Rollins, and Hamels. Who knows who’s next on the list for them?
Lock in one guy- just ONE guy this offseason, and I’ll feel better about the chances that there might be hope in going toe-to-toe with the Phillies ’til the middle of next decade.
Or
simply sign a FA outfielder when they are ready to walk. The Phillies do not seem to have a problem with payroll.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Werth is one of the best for next-offseason though. The list of OFs for next off-season isn’t particularly inspiring:
Outfielders
Alfredo Amezaga FLA
Pat Burrell TB
Eric Byrnes ARI
Frank Catalanotto MIL
Carl Crawford TB
Coco Crisp KC
Michael Cuddyer MIN *
David DeJesus KC *
Adam Dunn WAS
Jermaine Dye CWS
Jody Gerut MIL
Jose Guillen KC
Willie Harris WAS
Brad Hawpe COL *
Geoff Jenkins PHI
Austin Kearns WAS
Jason Kubel MIN *
Magglio Ordonez DET *
Marcus Thames DET
Jayson Werth PHI
*Option year in 2011
source: Cot’s Baseball Contracts
(List must not reflect recent non-tenders, e.g., Amezaga drops from this list because of his non-tender; he’s an FA now.)
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I think Jayson Werth would be a great signing for us next year...
Assuming we aren’t completely cash-strapped again next year. I would think he would be reasonably affordable and could slot in a RF and move Ethier to LF.
With this Halladay deal, I think the Phillies would have to push their payroll well north of $150 MM to keep Werth.
It would piss me off if we have to pay heavily in FA for Werth
After cutting him loose a few years ago.
Agreed...
but there is not one other FA out there that is interesting. Aside from Hawpe who has a club option and will cost even more if he is a FA.
Otherwise we have to fill that spot through trade or promotion of… Lambo? Robinson? Not a lot of options on the farm for as early as 2011.
If Pierre doesn't get traded before then
For the Dodgers… leading off… in left field… number nine….
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 3:36 PM PST up reply actions
I'd be thrilled to have an in-house option take over
Whether it be Lambo if he has a huge comeback year in AA/AAA in 2010 or maybe Kyle Russell if he can bring down the Ks and keep the power. I say Russell because he’s already older and I think he has a future in the MLB, even if it’s just as a Jeremy Burnitz. I also brought up the Ks because for some reason if someone strikes out a lot they arent good even if they slug .580.
Another option would be Xavier Paul, which might be cool.
Well, while its always exciting to see youngsters taking over
The way the team is currently built, that OF spot is vitally needed for solid offensive production.
Obviously, a lot can change between now and then, but just looking ahead for fun.
Yeah I know what you mean
With Loney, Martin, Furcal, no 2b, and in the next 2 years with Blake getting older, we need to get a TON of production of the outfield.
Kyle Russell played in A ball in '09
And struck out too much. Not to read too much into an offhand comment, but he was not mentioned by Watson among the players who would be a Jacksonville this coming year.
The amount I don’t know about prospects could fill an ocean, but it sure seems like he has a long way to go at the moment and won’t be ready for a starting OF position in 2011.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 3:43 PM PST up reply actions
And the amount I don't know about prospects is underscored
by the fact that I don’t know where the Dodgers’ AA team plays.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
I understand where he was in 09
and I really hate the strikeout argument. Let him strike out 200 times. If he can maintain a good walk rate and he can have that high slugging percentage who really cares? I would love to have adam dunn on the team if he could field anywhere near average.
Sorry if I seem aggravated, but I see real talent in Russell. Maybe it’s just the fact I am desperate to see some power on the Dodgers, but I think Russell could stick with the Dodgers in the future. I know 2011 would probly be too early, but players have made the jump from AA to the majors before, so if Russell can get some time in AA for more than a month or two he COULD be ready with a big spring training in 2011.
Of course, that’s being very hopeful on my account.
russell would not strike out 200 times in the big leagues given 600 at bats...
he would strike out 275 times at least..
He struck out in nearly 32% of his PAs in low A ball in his age-23 season! If low-A pitchers are doing that to him, what happens at the higher levels? Really, someone should harness the wind energy from this swing so they can claim credit for a smaller carbon footprint.
(To be fair, if he was born four days later, we’d call it his age-22 season. Still.)
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I'm hoping he makes an adjustment
I’ll admit, I’m just hopeful at this point because I love the power he has and the Dodgers haven’t developed any power hitters.
Once he starts failing (and he hasn’t yet) then I’ll concede that he can’t hit major league pitching.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:37 PM PST up reply actions
That’s how I feel about it. I know it’s being hopeful, too hopeful in fact, but come on, we need someone with power to step up in our system and be the power bat we’ve been dying for since Beltre left (though he wasn’t really that power bat either).
I love Either’s progress, but I’m not really sure we can hope for more than 30 jacks from him. I think Kemp is our best shot at a big power hitter, but I’d settle for him to be a .280/.360/.540 30/30 guy. Settle, lol.
when reynolds was 21 and russell was 23 they were both in the MWL… reynolds only struck out 107 times in the same number of PA as russell who struck out 175 times..
so 2 years older and 70 more strike outs..
I’m not talking about Russell being called up today and starting on the opening day 2010 roster. I’m saying if he shows enough improvement and kicks ass in spring training 2011 maybe he could be our starting LF in 2011.
Obviously big improvements need to be made, but it’s not out of the realm of possibility.
Nothing is out of the realm of possibility, I guess
But I still think you can file that one under “E” for “extraordinarily unlikely.”
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
Reynolds b-day is first week of August, Russell’s last week of June. Those seasons are really only 13 months apart in age. Still, KR has a lot of catching up to do, both to Reynolds and to pitches.
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I'd be really happy if
Russell turns out like Reynolds but maybe tops out at 35 homeruns, but consistently hits 27-33 a year. He still has to be able to take walks like he does now, though.
Hmm
Well… while I still think that the most likely scenario for opening day in LF is Juan Pierre (if he is not traded), the Dodgers have tired of his act before. If things go right for, say, Robinson, in ’10 at AA, and things continue to go right for him at AAA in April-May of ’11, then yeah, I can see that happening.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 3:54 PM PST up reply actions
I think Hawpe would command more $$ on the open market than Werth. Werth really just has one solid season under his belt, while Hawpe has been consistently performing at a high level for a while.
but hawpe is really a DH
and werth has atheltetism and great D
yes
but you have to get to the ball to throw someone out..
and the guy is slow like crazy and teams will not sign him and put him in RF when he becomes a free agent..
He’s slow, runs crappy routes, and has stone hands. Too much for the strong (but is it accurate?) arm to overcome.
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
sounds like a scouting report of
jamarcus russell to me..
slow.. he probably runs crappy routes.. he probably has stone hands.. strong inaccurate arm..
If Aumont is the only name we keep hearing from the Mariners
I’m going to assume that it’s not Lee, it’s not Hamels — it’s Blanton.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
so its not dominic brown..
they replece brown with taylor.
injuryexpert
RT @danport: I work for a porn company, and still this Halladay/Lee deal is the most interesting 3-way I’ve seen all day.
I’m activating my 2010 new year’s resolution to not consider Silverwidow hypotheticals 18 days early! :)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
Still lots to know about the 3-way trade
from Rosenthal:
The sources said Phillipe Aumont — a Canadian right-hander — is among the players headed from Seattle to Toronto in the deal; the source added the Philadelphia is expected to send one of its outfield prospects, possibly Michael Taylor, to the Blue Jays.
It wasn’t immediately clear how many players would be included in the deal. One person familiar with the talks said he didn’t anticipate an announcement on Monday, an indication that the customary review of medical records is not yet complete
and…
The trade is highly complex, sources say, with the Phillies receiving money from the Jays to help pay Halladay’s salary next season. Halladay is owed $15.75 million, but that number could be negotiated down as part of a new contract agreement.
The biggest loser of this deal might be Timmy "The Freak"
Cuz he is gonna have real competition for the CY
97.5 The Fanatic Reported (Philadelphia)
The Mariners are sending Aumont, Saunders, and Gillies to Toronto. NBC Sports also has Taylor going to Toronto.
Although, The Fanatic also said that Toronto wanted the Mariners’ prospects because they were all "Canadian pitchers" which is at least good for a chuckle.
gillies is basically Dee gordon 2.0
taylor is a big time power hitting outfielder..
and saunders is a guy who scouts think has 30 30 potential although i dont see the 30 homer part..
I saw Aumont just one time, in June, at a 66ers/High Desert game, and he was hitting 94-97 on the gun, and his curve was outstanding. Fooled the 66ers on a few occasions.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:37 PM PST up reply actions
Or Kershaw
Once again, we see the difference between what teams hint that they want and what they really accept.
Just like with Cliff Lee last July.
by Capt Obvious on Dec 14, 2009 11:47 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think it's terrible
One thing I’ve realized – we always think people ask for too much from us. I bet half of that is b/c we always insist that other teams eat money.
thats a whole outfield right there..
gillies CF with saunders right and taylor left.. or opposite..
and then a reliever whose canadian…
not really any impact starting pitchers.. that sucks,,. but toronto has a bunch of great young starters anyway..
If even two of those outfielders pan out
Jays fans are going to be feeling the pain of Dodgers fans over recent years, with these guys being blocked (Kemp/Ethier) and then $20+ MM sitting on the bench (Andruw/JP = Vernon Wells).
even tho thats what is being reported..
i would not be shocked if one of the outfielders is taken off.. and they add a SP like brandon morrow instead.. or trunfiel instead..
I don't ever trust Rosenthal but
Rosenthal and Morosi write that pitcher Phillippe Aumont of the Mariners and “possibly” outfielder Michael Taylor of the Phillies are among the players heading to Toronto in the trade. They add that outfielder Michael Saunders and pitcher Brandon Morrow are “in play.” The FOX duo confirms an agreement is in place to send Halladay to the Phillies and Lee to the Mariners.
Considering Rosenthal was the one who first broached the idea of a three-way halladay-lee trade
maybe he’s earned a pass on this one.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 2:37 PM PST up reply actions
damnnn!
the red sox rotation is crazy!!!
Lester, Beckett, Lackey, Matsuzaka, Buchholz
but i have no idea what they will do with wakefield..
and now they wil have some leverage against beckett when he becomes a free agent next year..
That is ridiculous
What does that rotation cost? I know Lester is somewhat cheap and Buchholz is cheap, but still!
beckett is like 11 mill per year
lester cheap.. buchholtz cheap..
matsuzaka is 12 mill a year? with a ridiculous posting fee tho
and lackey 85 mill for 5 years..
What scares me is that they might trade Buchholz in a deal for Gonzalez. I might kill someone if they get him.
Jeez, this really blows. All of the big name players are going to a certain few teams now.
It’s like
Red Sox
Yankees
Phillies
Everyone else
I know the Dodgers are still a very good team, and I know should have no huge problem winning 90 games again, but those 3 teams seem to just have a head-up on everyone else.
We have 3 starters right now. I’m not sure I’d pencil us in for 90 wins till I see what team we’re gonna field.
We had 4 real starters last season
The 5 spot was a mess last season, so I’m not worried there. I know one of Elbert, Mcdonald, Haegar, Stults won’t put up the season Wolf did, but I am not worried about the rotation as much as some people are.
Pure luck though, not skill
Stults, Weaver, Milton, Schmidt were most of that, and who really thinks all of them were that good?
I’d rather take my chances with Elbert or Haegar there. Mcdonald too.
Elbert IS ready. If he stays in AAA its just a case of management just hating Elbert. Mcdonald is the same type of case, though one of the two may end up in the bullpen.
Also, wasn’t the 5 spot just successful because of 1. Luck and 2. run support?
3. Hunger
It seemed to work. Every time they brought a guy up he seemed to pitch well. Schmit for heavens sakes.
Weaver also had a good year and limited the damage anyone would do and got a few wins himself.
I'll bet Elbert's pretty hungry for a spot in the rotation
after he’s proven himself so well in the minors.
Well I could be wrong, but aren't they are also the only three teams with payrolls north of $140 MM.
Mets possibly too, depending on what they do with Bay
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:52 PM PST up reply actions
kenley jensen....
tallest catcher in the history of baseball???
the man is listed as 6-6 221
Don Gile (Red Sox 1959-1962) was also listed at 6’6"
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:47 PM PST up reply actions
No
Baseball-Reference has Jansen at 6’2", 178.
MiLB.com (and Dodgers.com) has him at 6’2", 220
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:51 PM PST up reply actions
I’m guessing B-R got their weight sometime before last season :)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:51 PM PST up reply actions
espn has him at 6-6
and in the video i saw of him in the AFL… he is defintly not 6-2 178 or 220..
the man is at least 6-5 now..
You would be great identifying the height of robbers as they leave a bank or store. :)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:53 PM PST up reply actions
I agree
I don’t think he is 6’2, part of his problem with his long swing because of his height. Wasn’t Jayson Werth the tallest catcher to play this decade?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Baseball-Reference has Mauer and Wieters at 6’5".
Werth is also at 6’5" on B-R but never played C in the majors
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:57 PM PST up reply actions
I guess not
Werth only caught in the minor leagues.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
I'm shocked he didn't catch
at least one game in the majors.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Phil Nevin did though. And had one of the worst testicle stories in history because of it! :)
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions
Rk Player Ht G To From Age OPS
1 Joe Mauer 77 699 2004 2009 21-26 .892
2 Sandy Alomar 77 481 2000 2007 34-41 .675
3 Jarrod Saltalamac 76 238 2007 2009 22-24 .703
4 Ben Davis 76 409 2000 2004 23-27 .673
5 Eddie Taubensee 76 133 2000 2001 31-32 .696
6 Josh Bard 75 521 2002 2009 24-31 .715
7 John Buck 75 584 2004 2009 23-28 .705
8 Ramon Castro 75 483 2000 2009 24-33 .730
9 Brian McCann 75 611 2005 2009 21-25 .853
10 Chad Moeller 75 492 2000 2009 25-34 .639
11 Ronny Paulino 75 384 2005 2009 24-28 .722
12 A.J. Pierzynski 75 1221 2000 2009 23-32 .754
13 Chris Snyder 75 491 2004 2009 23-28 .731
14 Rob Bowen 75 216 2003 2008 22-27 .639
15 Toby Hall 75 686 2000 2008 24-32 .671
16 Damian Miller 75 821 2000 2007 30-37 .737
17 Mike Piazza 75 931 2000 2007 31-38 .872
18 Tim Laker 75 117 2001 2006 31-36 .611
19 Javy Lopez 75 847 2000 2006 29-35 .819
20 Mike Matheny 75 803 2000 2006 29-35 .652
21 Todd Pratt 75 409 2000 2006 33-39 .753
22 Chris Widger 75 242 2000 2006 29-35 .673
23 Dan Wilson 75 538 2000 2005 31-36 .657
24 Tom Wilson 75 214 2001 2004 30-33 .714
25 Bill Haselman 75 182 2000 2003 34-37 .714
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 12/14/2009.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Moot point now that he's a catcher though
I guess? Sure is a tall mo-fo though.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
And by "catcher"
I meant “pitcher” of course. The one who throws to the catcher. I’ll be slinking off to dinner, now.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
The Jays were stupid to turn down Bell/Elbert/EMartin/Gordon if that’s what Ned offered. That’s easily on par if not better than what they’re getting.
It’s speculation, but Ned strongly intimated that Martin and Gordon were involved. And I figured that Bell would have gone to Toronto instead of Baltimore.
Scratch this whole post. I completely forgot that Ned was gunning for Lee with these types of players, not Halladay.
Even still
a package centered around Gordon, Martin (or Withrow), and Bell would be better than they ended up getting?
by Capt Obvious on Dec 15, 2009 12:01 AM PST up reply actions
From Dave Cameron
Stark reports Halladay extension is 3/60. Way to leave $100 million on the table, Doc
That is fucking bullshit if true
I’m tired of these teams that are already good getting such favorable contracts. Especially while we continue to go year-to-year with all of our good players, instead of getting any kind of deal EVER
I'd say
last year most of the group was tickled that we got Manny for 2/40.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Yea but no one else wanted to pay him that much
Teams would be LINING UP to take on Halladay at 3/60
I think you have to many teams
willing to spend 20 Million on one player based on their current payrolls. JMO
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
To put that contract in perspective
that is only one 1//20 more then what we gave Mr. Jones.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Mind Boggling
I like a guy who is confident in his own skills. He sets himself up for live but isn’t tied to Philly for more then a few years if he hates it.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
World Series still fresh
from Lookout Landing (SB Nation Mariners site):
Cliff Lee is a trending topic, and Roy Halladay is not
From Jayston Stark
on ESPN:
According to a source who spoke with two teams involved in the trade, Toronto would get highly regarded Mariners pitching prospect Phillippe Aumont, Phillies catching prospect Travis d’Arnaud and another Phillies prospect in exchange for Halladay. Indications are that the Phillies have balked at Toronto’s repeated requests for outfielder Domonic Brown, and the Phillies are offering highly touted outfielder Michael Taylor instead.
Seattle would also send two prospects to Philadelphia in exchange for Lee, who is a year away from free agency
Please don’t tell me the Phillies get to keep prospects here.
Kind of awesome
from the Phillie point of view. Hard to not take my hat off to Amaro. They end with the guy they wanted all along, they still have at least Brown or Taylor along with Drabeck plus whatever the Mariners are sending their way and if the rumor be true an incredible deal regarding the extension.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
That can't be true
Philly gets prospects and Halladay?
Travis d’ Arnaud sucks, and so the Jays would only get a RP, a crappy catcher and a good OF prospect… THATS IT?
Doesn't seem plausible
I’m not going to post anymore about this until we see the final deal.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Why the Giants still suck?
From MCC :Ryan Garko not tendered a contract
Help me out. Pick the most reasonable option. Did the Giants..
a. judge a player on 100 at-bats. Like, they honestly, truthfully thought that 100 at-bats were enough to change their minds about a player, or
not really scout a player they acquired in a trade for the third-best pitching prospect in their systemIf we yield now, all is over; but if we fight, there is yet a hope that we may stand upright
si's jon heyman
hearing aumont is likely in #mariners pending deal for cliff lee. perhaps michael saunders, too. morrow may stay.
mike cameron in serious talks with the red sox
on a 2 year deal
http://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/6677312207
does that mean ellsbury goes to left..
and no bay or holliday?
well thats a serious offensive downgrade.. but it tremendously helps their D
and then after they have AGon, the Yanks’ response is to buy Holliday, and those two teams duke it out while the rest of the AL gets to watch.
how can they buy halladay tho??
he signed a 3 year 60 million dollar deal with philly
lol
read it wrong..
but yeah holliday wont do anything in the al..
the mans heart will always lie in the nl..
wow what a perfect match!!!!
angels need a 5th starter!!!!! (derek Lowe)!!!!
Braves desperatly need a RH hitting left fielder!!! (juan rivera!!!!!!!)
It really couldnt be a more perfect match,,,,
As the blockbuster nears completion, the Braves are an interested bystander. The Angels now appear to be among the favorites to acquire Derek Lowe. They could offer outfielder Juan Rivera, who is the type of right-handed run producer that Atlanta is seeking.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/10523430/Source:-Halladay-to-Phils,-Lee-to-M%27s-in-blockbuster
Probably dollars. Interesting that one season removed from signing Lowe to a contract for 4/60, they are just dying to dump him. How quickly did he wear out his welcome there?
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
and nobody knew
javier vasquez was… this good
Or of Lowe having his worst year as a starting pitcher
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
2005 ERA+ 114 (with the Dodgers)
I think you are thining of 2004 which was his last year with Boston. ERA+90
Last season ERA+ of 88.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:36 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, my bad
I was thinking we had Lowe on a 3 year contract, not 4. Right after I remembered we had him in 05. I just thought, how could we have him in 05, everyone was trash minus Kent in 05.
A lot of us thought 4/60 was ridiculous for him though. If Atlanta thought that was a fine offer, one year is souring them on him?
The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I cant remember...
but wasn’t Lowe one of the early signings that everyone was saying WTF? Similar to some of the early signings we’ve seen this year?
if you are an angels fan..
that is your worst nightmare
Thought this was post worthy
6:18pm: An interesting update to Jayson Stark’s article. Prior to turning to the M’s, the Phillies first attempted to complete a two-team deal with Toronto alone for Halladay. However, when Philly refused to include their top pitching prospect Kyle Drabek – as they did last summer – they got Seattle involved.
The Phillies also tried to move Joe Blanton in an effort to make space on the payroll for Doc – but couldn’t get enough back to allow them to make a Halladay deal. Stark also adds that the team did no actual negotiating with Lee on an extension but had heard that he was seeking a C.C. Sabathia-type contract. This was apparently enough to put a scare into Ruben Amaro Jr. & Co.
Why do I have a sinking feeling
that the Dodgers will end up with nobody when all is said and done?
Even a man who is pure in heart and says his prayers by night, may become a wolf when the wolfbane blooms and the autumn moon is bright.
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:40 PM PST reply actions
Are your exclamation points out of excitement or anger that Garland is who we will likely end up with?
i dont know!!!
it just sucks that the dodgers dont have money.
I'd drink to that
but, y’know, no money…
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
Josh Towers doesn’t count
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:43 PM PST up reply actions
Some random idiot on Dodgers.com
RE: Billingsley
“headcase”
“should have traded him when he was worth something”
“number 3 or 4 starter”
Insurance?
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
That’s why I can’t read the comments on Dodgers.com. MLBTR is getting closer and closer to that point as well.
It reached that point
when Braves fans said they’d only trade Javy Vazquez for Ethier or Kemp
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:48 PM PST up reply actions
just saying
the idea that a year of Vazquez was worth two/three years of Kemp/Ethier was just moronic
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 4:51 PM PST up reply actions
Number 2 point `
May prove to be true.
He was not any number starter after the middle of September.
I will add that I don’t trust medical opinions expressed on internet sites.
Torre's decision to start Kuroda over Billingsley was stupid
Him not starting was not indicative of his ability at that time, it was “chasing the wheel” coaching.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
i would argue against the
Torre’s decision to start Kuroda over Billingsley was stupid
but i have done it enough… and im sick of keep saying that it wasnt
Because, he was clearly unhealthy and barely pitched in a month?
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:55 PM PST up reply actions
Well I can’t argue his health as I am no doctor and I didn’t see him pitch prior to being put on the playoff roster. But if he was said to be healthy, and looked good, which apparently was the case, then it was the right move.
So you are assuming that he looked good, because the Dodgers decided to start him, and he was healthy because the Dodgers decided to start him. In that case, whatever move the Dodgers make is the right one, because we are not doctors nor did we see him pitch before the pitching appearance.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
Or I could assume that because he didn’t pitch well that he was unhealthy and wasn’t ready to pitch.
But I guess you’re right, I should add further clarification. It was the right decision if he was healthy and ready, but I have no way of knowing.
And no, I don’t blindly trust the Dodgers staff, and should change the “apparently was the case” to “hopefully was the case”.
Okay
So you would argue it, but you won’t, so you felt like posting that you wont.
Awesome, excellent point Matthew.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 4:54 PM PST up reply actions
because there is no point of getting into this argument..
we have had it so many times on this blog that its enough..
Ya
I was just in a shitty mood at work anyway, so I’m glad you just ignored me.
My bad.
by Michael White on Dec 14, 2009 7:12 PM PST up reply actions
I’m sorry? Billingsley is worth more than Buchholz, who is the main guy that gets dangled in superstar trade talks by the Red Sox.
Is he for the Padres
They are concerned with high skills, cost controlled years. For the Padres Bucholz might be a better value then Billingsley since the whole point of trading Adrian is get major league ready players with as many cost controlled years that you can.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
There's real worth and perception
And right now, Chad is certainly in the category of someone you don’t want to give up on but right now, it is all on him to bounce back.
oops
meant to write: I am jealous of teams getting top pitchers like Lackey, Halladay, and Lee, but this rotation combined with the best bullpen in the NL does not bother me.
Only thing I’d add is that Haeger and Stults are out of options so they would have to clear waivers to be sent to the minors if they don’t make the rotation in ST.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 4:59 PM PST up reply actions
that’s why you are the blogger and I am the commentator. I knew Stults was out of options so I didn’t include him, but not Haeger.
Couldn't one of them be the long reliever?
I know they haven’t seemed particularly suited for that role, but nonetheless…
I don't see Torre
letting Haeger become part of the rotation but I do think he’d be okay with him as the long reliever. On the other hand I don’t think he’d let Stults be a long man but would prefer him out of the rotation.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
all mop-up duty (down 3, 5, and 7 in his three relief apps).
I suppose he could take over the Weaver role, but I would bet against it.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:09 PM PST up reply actions
I don’t think Torre likes either one in that role. More likely would be Elbert in that role or (since he has options) moved to AAA for the start, to let Haeger (or maybe Stults) work their way out of the rotation.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
Honestly if the dollars are the same, I think I'd rather have Padilla.
Then again, I have no idea if he can pound the strikezone with 95 MPH heat over the course of a full season.
I don't know about any of you
but if the Dodgers can get one starting pitcher (on a big league contract) and a competent 2B for a platoon role, I’ll consider this offseason as a success
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:00 PM PST reply actions
I won't consider it a success
but it is better then some of the more pessimistic alternatives.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Which is my point
I’m one of the people believing the pessimistic alternatives
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:05 PM PST up reply actions
I think it all depends on what kind of pitcher the Dodgers can get for Pierre
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:06 PM PST up reply actions
If they can get one
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:06 PM PST up reply actions
Exactly. If the Dodgers can get Arroyo (or please please please Harang) and just re-sign Belliard, I’d go to war with that team in 2010.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:07 PM PST up reply actions
Some more details (differing) from CSN Philly
From Jim Salsbury:
Once the extension is complete, the Phillies are expected send three prospects to Toronto. A source identified those prospects as Drabek, outfielder Michael Taylor and catcher Travis D’Arnaud. The Blue Jays would also get a prospect from Seattle, possibly Canadian pitcher Phillippe Aumont. The Phillies could also end up with a prospect from Seattle. The Mariners are a key to the deal as they are expected to get Cliff Lee and his $9 million salary from the Phillies. The Phillies have a strict $140 million payroll so moving Lee appears to be a necessity.
Halladay will make $15.75 million in 2010. The Phillies are expected to cover the bulk of that salary with the $9 million they are freeing up by trading Lee, as well as a $6 million payout from the Blue Jays
More cost for Philly in terms of prospects, but only a $750k addition to their 2010 payroll.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
A lot depends on just whom Philly receives from Seattle
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
I just read, the Phillies wouldn't include Drabek
Hahah its going to change ten times by tomorrow
Joe Blanton had a physical
as did J.A. Happ and Dominic Brown, per MLBTR
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
Ha! I called it!
Timestamped 5:04 EST!
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 5:11 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe a different trade
for all you know we may have just flipped Chris Withrow for Joe Blanton and WIthrow is now headed to Toronto instead of Drabek. Just saying this deal has had more flip flops then a day at the beach.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
If we traded Withrow for Joe Blanton
I will be shitting and vomiting at the same time as if I just drank a jug mexican tap water.
That is a perfect image for the proper reaction to that trade.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:18 PM PST up reply actions
If it were four years ago
then yeah, everybody wins
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:22 PM PST up reply actions
Yea except for Toronto
Who gets a crappy SS, a crappy Catcher, and maybe a good OF
I find it fascinating that we are trying to carry on 8 different conversation in this thread just because we have been introduced to the z button.
Yup
the knowledge of Z has changed the world of blog chatter.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
everytime a new comment is posted, it tells you about the z button. How did you guys not notice it until now?
Because I never
read the fine print. How many here actually read the taglines for every poster?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Sherrill for Blanton, Sherrill for Blanton, Sherrill for Blanton
say it three times and click your heels three times and your wish will come true….
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
You want Blanton?
He’s a poor man’s Brad Penny!
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:32 PM PST up reply actions
the only thing in common with blanton is
they both are fat..
otherwise blanton actually has offspeed pitches…
at least blanton has some movement?
are you defending mister penny..
LOL
I made the comment in reference to their girth
but still, I’d probably take Penny before Blanton, and I certainly wouldn’t trade Sherrill for Penny
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:37 PM PST up reply actions
league average starters are worth far more than non-dominant relievers.
The only concern I would have with Blanton is…is the difference in leagues that wide, or has he been playing over his head? He struck out 5.1 batters per nine in the AL, and 7.2 in the NL. Can he keep that up?
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:40 PM PST up reply actions
It is the hair
has always been and always will be.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
How that son of a bitch
landed that Dancing with the Stars babe, I’ll never know
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 5:38 PM PST up reply actions
Yes
And drunk.
What were we talking about?
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 9:42 PM PST up reply actions
jorgearangure
Hey #bluejays fans you might be losing Halladay, but source tells me Toronto signed Ramon Castro to a one year deal worth near $1m
What are the Jays doing
signing three catchers this off-season? All overpaid imho.
They also signed John Buck and re-signed Raul Chavez.
And none of them will be catching Halladay.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
all overpaid?
chavez is a minor league deal..
buck is 2 mill
and castro is less then 1 mill
its better then signing pudge and kendall to 2 year deals
Thought Castro for a million was
overpaid but then I looked around at other veteran backup catcher contracts and take it back, you guys are right. It’s all relative. Agree about Pudge and Kendall.. how does the latter keep getting these contracts, while being one of the worst hitters in baseball for last ten years?
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
GM
seem to prize the ability to handle pitching which I assume is the only skill Kendall has but I’ve yet to see a correlation between Jason Kendall catching and superlative pitching performances.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
I believe Aaron Harang would be that ceiling.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:44 PM PST up reply actions
that’s what I was thinking. Reds would have to deal Cordero though I would think, and his contract is pretty…. pretty….. big
It would be roughly salary neutral for them in 2010 though. Maybe not so bad for them.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 14, 2009 5:46 PM PST up reply actions
I'd do that trade.
Which makes me wonder if the Reds would.
The Ultimate Ned's Kind of Guy
by Humma Kavula on Dec 14, 2009 5:48 PM PST up reply actions
RE: Matsui
I thought this line, by Noah Coslov of MLB.com, was funny:
we’ve come to the conclusion that if Matsui were to walk across the while lines with his glove on, he’d go Field of Dreams and disappear
and they say he will play left field
with ellsbury in center..
i bet the red sox sign beltre now..
they are caring about Defense ALOT right now..
I guess but wasting a CF like Cameron
in left field in Fenway just doesn’t make sense. You don’t get to do much as a LF in Fenway.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Boston bolsters
rotation in a big way and still gets a solid LF even if he is not Jason Bay. However that offense looks like it needs the great Ortiz to make some hay. Not exactly a scary lineup. I wonder if Hermida will platoon with Cameron or if we really are seeing the first salvo before a big deal with the Padres for Gonzalez which would include Ellsbury?
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
7:51pm: Elliott says (via Twitter) that Drabek is in the deal, but Aumont is not.
If that is the case, I’m presuming its not Lee, but rather Hamels or (shudder) Blanton getting dealt.
its lee
lee is getting dealt..
cliff lee
Actually - you may not be that far off
I guess sporting news radio is saying it’s Happ to Seattle, not Lee
I'm fucking pissed
they can’t have Halladay and Lee and Hamels!
especially just giving up Happ and/or Blanton and some other BS garbage like D’ Arnaud
they are giving up drabek happ taylor darnod for halladay..
that seems pretty fair.. but for dodger fans, it sucks cause we have to face halladay lee in the playoffs
hey everyone
is it Drabek > Withorw > Aumont> Martin????
damn phillies good move by them
at least manny will be playing for his contract
40 hrs haha
then i think its
withrow = drabek > martin > aumont
thanks
surprised to see you like martin better than aumont
I remember aumont throwing some nasty changeups in AFL gameday
like nasty
by hirambocachica on Dec 14, 2009 6:42 PM PST up reply actions
aumont
is a reliever.. and has had many injury issuess..
martin is a starter which is always more valuable..
KenDavidoff
Bengie Molina, citing 2-year deals given to other catchers, wants 3 years from the #Mets.
Oh lord...
is all I can say…
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants country, and damned proud of it.
TMZ with a McScrooge update
http://www.tmz.com/2009/12/14/frank-mccourt-jamie-and-boyfriend-are-frauds/
My favorite bit:
McCourt claims in the docs that Jamie — whom he fired as Dodgers CEO in October — has had a negative impact on the Dodgers and Major League Baseball as she “drags her feet [and] promotes herself, directly and through her surrogate Fuller, as a co-owner of the team.”
Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/12/14/frank-mccourt-jamie-and-boyfriend-are-frauds/#ixzz0Zij3KLH4
And the other shoe has fallen on Tiger Woods.
A Canadian doctor who has treated many N.F.L. players as well as Olympic medalists like Donovan Bailey and the world’s top golfer, Tiger Woods, is under criminal investigation in the United States for allegedly providing athletes with performance-enhancing drugs, according to several people who have been briefed on the investigation.
Performance enhancing drugs?
(hint-hint, wink-wink, nudge-nudge)
My mouth's bleedin', Burt! My mouth's bleedin'!
by Mr. LA Sports Fan on Dec 14, 2009 6:55 PM PST up reply actions
tigers wood cheats on his wife
and uses performance enhancing drugs..
wow
wow tiger wow
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NL West Standings
| W | L | PCT | GB | STRK | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
San Diego
|
79 | 59 | .572 | 0 | Won 3 |
|
San Francisco
|
78 | 62 | .557 | 2 | Lost 1 |
|
Colorado
|
75 | 64 | .539 | 4.5 | Won 6 |
|
Los Angeles
|
69 | 71 | .492 | 11 | Lost 5 |
|
Arizona
|
57 | 83 | .407 | 23 | Won 1 |
(updated 9.8.2010 at 10:10 PM PDT)
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