Joe Torre is not our guy.
by Tripon on Aug 10, 2009 10:13 PM PDT
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Jesus Christ, stop asking people to bunt when the opposing pitcher is fucking struggling with his command and the first two batters have hits against him. Don't ask Russell Martin to bunt, especially after he shown you *three* times this season, and once tonight in the Dodgers-Giants game that he doesn't know how to bunt.
Joe Torre, come on. Let your players play. That was a great opportunity for Martin to get a hit and some RBIs. And you took it away from him, and the rally was quickly extinguished.
Also, I am not a Clippers fan, but I will watch some of their games. And If I have to make a wild prediction, I would say that in three years they will have the better team over the Lakers. That is if Eric Gordon and Blake Griffin somehow avoid career threatening injuries. I'd put that at a 50/50 chance.
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i agree on the martin bunting stuff
but come on,,,the Clipped better than the Lake Show. Only if KB retires Pau keeps injuring himself in international play and Bynum runs in to Kobe constantly and……
Gasol is a FA after next year, Odom is 29, Kobe is 31, everyone is waiting for Bynum to take that next step
And nobody knows if he can really do it. Farmar doesn’t look like a starting PG. Artest is Artest, and in three years will not be starting material.
Meanwhile, the only old guy that the Clippers have signed to a long term contract is Baron Davis. The Clippers are made to win in 2-3 years, the Lakers are built to win now.
Im sure Gasol loves playing in LA so well lock him up
This team the lakers have is built to be title contender for the next 3-4 years, after that it should be interesting
by SeanMillerSavior on Aug 10, 2009 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions
i dont see the clipps being better than the lakers in only 3 years
but i think theyll be a playoff team
when eric gordon and griffin get more years of experience (6-7 years)
then they might be a contender
you better hope the clips
6-7 years? they won’t be clippers anymore. didn’t we get excited about d-miles, q, lamar, et al? players seem to beeline out of that franchise after their rookie contracts.
things have changed in the clippers
look griffin and ej can really turn the franchise around, i think it would take less than 6-7 years to make clips contenders, and if they can get cap space they could make a run at lebron.
2006 wasn't that long ago
and if memory serves KB was on that team too. The Clippers were clearly the better team that year and advanced further in the playoffs. As such, making a prediction that the Clips would be a better team in 3 years (when they have been as recently as 3 years ago) isn’t that earth shattering.
by Michael White on Aug 11, 2009 7:32 AM PDT up reply actions
Amen
At least the first time Russell showed bunt, it was clear that Renteria was cheating toward second to try and hold Pierre. I’m not a huge hit-and-run fan, but Torre is looking at his two rabbits, Pierre and Furcal at 2nd and 1st and his FIRST choice is to bunt? On 1-1, he still could have sent the runners, which could have created a huge hold between Renteria dogging Pierre at 2nd and Panda moving to cover 3rd.
Still curious why Molina threw to second when the runners did finally go. Did Sandoval not cover? Was it planned by the Giants to only go for the out at second and not have Sandoval open the hole wider by covering third? And why didn’t Furcal slide, might have been safe had he slid to the outside.
Whoa
I know that comment is a joke because JP never, ever gets a good jump. He never steals on the pitcher and always steals on the catcher.
by Seanny Rotten on Aug 11, 2009 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions
joe torre is not our guy because
if your going to use kuo(one of the best relievers in MLB) use him for more then 1 guy and then belisario, same with him… whats wrong with joe… he doesnt know bullpens have feelings too
I had no problem with his bullpen usage tonight. He had four guys well rested, and the two he used in the 7th were to gain a platoon advantage. Kuo threw 6 pitches, and Belisario 3, and shouldn’t be hindered at all tomorrow, or maybe even Wednesday if needed.
by Eric Stephen on Aug 10, 2009 11:07 PM PDT up reply actions
oh alright
i didnt see the game tonight.. but i looked at the box score and i was like why use 2 of your best relievers for only 1 batter each?
also why did kuroda go out after only 93 pitches? he didnt seem like he was in much trouble.
by matthewmafa on Aug 10, 2009 11:39 PM PDT up reply actions
I would have kept Kuroda in myself, at least to finish the 7th or at least until another runner got on base (one was on base when he was pulled).
by Eric Stephen on Aug 10, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions
now i see why our bullpen throws the most innings in the MLB
and our starters go so short
by matthewmafa on Aug 10, 2009 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm not so sure Eric
the thing with Kuo is not the pitches he throws in the game but the warming up. Sure, he only had 6 pitches, but he did a full warm up and the plan was to not use Kuo back to back. I found the bullpen usage strange but nothing to get too worked up about. Your starting pitcher is cruising, goes 6.1 and the Dodgers still end up using 5 pitchers. I know it’s a big game but it was unnecessary.
by Michael White on Aug 11, 2009 7:34 AM PDT up reply actions
Torre's strategy and tactics may have shifted after he learned it wouldn't be Billingsley starting on Wednesday
By shifting Kuroda out a day, he set up the best rotation he could for this series, but Billingsley’s hammy wouldn’t cooperate. He got his opening win – the three run lead was the bird in the hand he didn’t want to lose while reaching for two birds in the bush -and now he only needs to win a game that pits Randy Wolf vs. Joe Martinez as the starters to win the series and guarantee the Giants lose at least one game in the standings before even having to face Lincecum.
Where Torre got lucky is that Sherrill, despite giving up a hit, completed his inning in only ten pitches, so he should be available tonight as well. I was getting concerned that he was using up both his left-handed relievers in game one, since you can never be certain how Kuo will bounce back the next day, and Sherrill’s one inning could just as easily have ended up being 20+ pitches.
Ok, I'm actually kind of with you here . . .
WTF was with using almost all of his lefthanded relievers last year as LOOGYs in the playoffs? I thought Joe Beimel was pretty solid one of the best relievers in the league last year (ERA + OF 210!!!!), and yet when October rolled around it was LOOGY duty only.
by Seanny Rotten on Aug 11, 2009 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions
Beimel
While his ERA+ was 210 (which is insane) his FIP was only 3.30. While that FIP is solid, several Dodger relievers were better last season including Saito, Broxton, Kuo and Troncoso (who didn’t even make the post-season roster.) Add in the fact that Kershaw was pitching out of the pen and Torre was smitten with JMac and there wasn’t too much room for Beimel. The only guy who got work in the post-season out of the bullpen who was clearly worse was Maddux (a PVL) and Wade who while some were sounding the alarms that his success was based on luck, Torre had trust in him because of his performance during that regular season.
I agree with your sentiment though, that these guys like Kuo, Beimel and Sherril are good pitchers who happen to be left-handed, and shouldn’t be treated as 1 batter specialists.
by Michael White on Aug 11, 2009 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions
if anything
sherrill should be a LOOGY and kuo should have pitched the 8th… sherrill has way more trouble getting rightys out then kuo
by matthewmafa on Aug 11, 2009 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah but which reliever had more WINS? EHHHH?? HUH?? Tell me that!
I’ll tell you who, NO ONE! And as Joe Morgan said in Baseball for Dummies, “Pitching Wins is how you evaluate how good a pitcher is.”
by Seanny Rotten on Aug 11, 2009 6:46 PM PDT up reply actions
no, but it does tell you a great deal about starters
and, no offense to chad – but there’s a reason tim is worth 10 mil more per season on the open market. squeezing wins out of those horrible SF bats is hard.
by stillnotah8er on Aug 12, 2009 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions
No it doesn't
it’s common sense. You don’t look at Wins and Losses to evaluate pitchers.
If a pitcher throws 8 innings and gives up 1 run and loses, what does that tell you about pitchers?
If a pitcher throws 5 innings and gives up 6 runs and wins, what does that tell you about the pitcher?
ERA while flawed is much more effective. I prefer FIP and x-FIP.
by Michael White on Aug 12, 2009 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I completely understand your point
But answer me this – does the W difference between Tim and Chad tell you anything about their performance? Of course it does. The pitcher is the natural captain of the team.
I was at the 110 degree game where Sabathia beat the D’s last year. That game is why CC makes the big bucks. Real warriors go 120 pitches and leave with the lead.
by stillnotah8er on Aug 12, 2009 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Lincecum is clearly better than Chad, and has had a much better season, yet only has one more win. It’s just not a good metric to use.
If you want to compare them, a much more compelling case can be made if you use IP/start, BB/9, K/9, ERA, ERA+, FIP, x-FIP, etc.
Also, the 120-pitch argument is a red-herring. Lincecum has thrown 120+ twice this season, and Chad has done it once. Not a big difference.
by Eric Stephen on Aug 12, 2009 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions
The pitcher is the natural captain of the team?
There is no “natural captain” anywhere. You play to win, all the time.
I agree with white 100%. FIP provides a better evaluation of pitchers.
Answer me this: Who are you pick?
Tim Wakefield: 11-3, 4.31 ERA, 1.38 WHIP
or
Clayton Kershaw: 8-6, 2.71 ERA, 1.20 WHIP
the relative age
and the fact that one is (and has been) the only effective knuckleball starter in the league for a while makes that one a bit spurious…
by stillnotah8er on Aug 12, 2009 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions
you would take
Livan Hernandez over Jake Peavy last year then?
by Chad Moriyama on Aug 18, 2009 10:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh I would TOTALLY have (not) taken Livan over Peavy last year!
I mean Livan had more WINS. W I N S! That is how we measure pitchers’ effectiveness. Peavy didn’t win many games. Furthermore, Livan is considerably older. A veteran pitcher will always defeat a youngster. Always.
Also, small sample sizes tell us everything we need to know about baseball. The Dodgers’ whole season so far and the fact their Pythagorean W/L is about on par w/ their actual, W/L? Pah! Bogus, parents’ basement hocus pocus! The fact is, they didn’t get an “ace” by the trading deadline, they’re 14-16 in their last 30. PANIC! EVERYBODY PANIC!! WE’RE CHOKERS AND NOT CHAMPIONS!
A third thing, Kurt Streeter is perhaps the 2nd best LATimes writer. Second only to Plassskey. There’s no WAY he just cherry picked a bunch of stats to make that column make sense and ignored facts that would have poked holes in it.
by Seanny Rotten on Aug 20, 2009 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
very witty
I never said wins were the most signficant factor. But they are far from totally meaningless.
Leaving with the lead is something winners just make a habit of doing.
Winning a single game with the bats in the SD outfield in the past couple of years is an achievement.
by stillnotah8er on Aug 21, 2009 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions
sorry, mean infield
Kouz, Khalil (when he was there), etc
by stillnotah8er on Aug 21, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought the catcher was the Field General, no?
by Seanny Rotten on Aug 12, 2009 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Joe Morgan=baseball BY dummies
f**k, man, there's a beverage here!
by seesdifferent on Aug 12, 2009 9:01 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol
i like how this whole “is not our guy” running joke is actually sparking real conversation
William Doolittle at your service, a.k.a. will do.
and if we had had another bad night behind the plate,
I would consider throwing up a Donnie Baseball is not our guy post..
William Doolittle at your service, a.k.a. will do.
Your post is simply ridiculous.....................
The Clippers will have the better team in one year not three with Jordan ending up better then Bynum.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
I LOL'd
i’d like to believe that the years of futility are going to end, but i have 0 faith. Also, Jordan isn’t learning from the most prolific center in NBA history… he’s got gobs of talent, but we all know that doesn’t equate to success.
p.s. olowokandi.
I’m normally pro-Clippers, but to think they will be better than the Lakers in 2010-2011 seems a little too far-fetched.
by Eric Stephen on Aug 11, 2009 9:21 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
One team is young and one is old
The younger team will get better, the older team will get older. Of course it is far fetched, who remembers conservative prognostications?
I’m am willing to make a bet that in the year of 2011/2012 the Clippers will either
a. win more games then the Lakers
b. advance farther in the playoffs
That is the midway point between what Tripon said and what I said.
Hopefully we are all alive by the time the bet says yea or nea
by meercatjohn on Aug 11, 2009 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions
Sterling=fail
In the rare years that the Clips are better than the lakers, Buss will go out and spend to correct that, no matter how steep the luxury tax is..Sterling will not
William Doolittle at your service, a.k.a. will do.
i am clippers fan and agree you
2011-2012 will be the season
I would like to see a what if scenario if Danny Manning never got hurt.
by Eric Stephen on Aug 11, 2009 11:18 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd rather see a scenario
if Ron Harper had not torn his ACL but we will forget the past and focus on the future. Never in my time as a Clipper fan have had a player like Blake Griffin, Eric Gordon, and Jordan on the team at the same time. These are all elite talents and all under 22 years old.
by meercatjohn on Aug 11, 2009 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions
they shoulda picked VC, Dirk, or even Pierce in the 98 draft
i wonder where they would be….
but hey clipps and blazers r the teams of the future….
I agree 1 of those 2 teams are the teams of the future…..
by Michael White on Aug 11, 2009 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions
Everyone forgets...
Clippers are cursed and have been cursed since their time here in L.A.
Wouldn’t be surprised if Griffen tears his ACL or worse, i feel bad for him. God bless him.
Oh yeah and they have Mike Dumbleavy
Ya, I read Bill Simmons too.
And dismissing the Clippers as “cursed” is pretty lame and unoriginal.
by Michael White on Aug 11, 2009 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions
Are you serious? Do you believe in magic? Does what happened to players in the 70’s and 80’s have anything to do with current players? I’ll just assume you are joking.
by Michael White on Aug 12, 2009 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm neither frustrated nor angry
but if you believe that any of the past poor performance is due to an indian curse then I have a bridge to sell you.
by Michael White on Aug 12, 2009 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions
We know where Joe's heart remains...
Joe Torre is not our guy. He still readily supports an east coast green tea manufacturer. If Joe was truly our guy, then he would throw his endorsement behind Good Earth Green Tea
2009-10 LA Kings Hockey: Where Smyt Happens!!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Aug 11, 2009 11:56 AM PDT reply actions
Nice joke, but
From Good Earth’s “Contact Us” link:
GOOD EARTH® COFFEE
Consumer Services Department
890 Mountain Avenue, Suite 105
New Providence, NJ 07974
by David Young on Aug 11, 2009 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, so sorry Dave, but thanks for playing!!!
Because the address you referenced is just the location that they outsource their Customer Relations at. Good Earth Green Tea Company HQ is actually at:
831 Almar Ave
Santa Cruz, CA 95060-5804
(831) 423-7913
2009-10 LA Kings Hockey: Where Smyt Happens!!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Aug 11, 2009 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Somehow I would expect better customer relations in
Santa Cruz rather than New Jersey. “You wanna keep complainin’ or you wanna sleep widda fishes?”
Did you know that the original Good Earth Sweet & Spicy™ Tea contains artificial flavors, more than any other flavoring ingredient in the product.
It's Santa Cruz...
The only sports they care about are Frisbee Golf and World Team Drum Circle… :-)
2009-10 LA Kings Hockey: Where Smyt Happens!!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Aug 11, 2009 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Could be worse, Cecil Cooper could be our manager
Cecil Cooper made a peculiar decision in the sixth inning Monday night, intentionally walking Nick Johnson to pitch to one of baseball’s best hitters [Hanley Ramirez].
It was a right-handed relief pitcher on the mound.
hanley ramirez puts up Albert pujol numbers
against right handed pitchers… but for some reason is just decent against left handed pitchers…. anyone know why?
How did it work out?
I’m going to assume a runner was on 2nd and not 1st. I’d probably do this, but then I respect Nick Johnson’s bat then most. He’s gotten off to a good start for the Marlins, great trade for them. No team made a bigger move up then having Johnson take over 1st and sliding Cantu over to 3rd to replace the gnat.
Definitely a good trade by the Fish
Maybe Houston hates all their LOOGYs, the guys that should be pitching to Johnson.
I'll take your money.
f**k, man, there's a beverage here!
torre not our guy??????????
are you stupid or do u not understand moving base runners? did we not score 4 runs that inning? torre is the best thing to happen to the dodgers in a long time. look at the record since torre and look at the to years prior. you should respect the man that has moor baseball knowledge in his toe nail than u or iwill ever have. so give him a pat on the back not a slap in the face u ingrate
by lifetime dodger on Aug 12, 2009 3:06 PM PDT reply actions
2009-10 LA Kings Hockey: Where Smyt Happens!!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Aug 12, 2009 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Old Model?
2009-10 LA Kings Hockey: Where Smyt Happens!!
by DodgerBlueBalls on Aug 12, 2009 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions
lets not get padilla in there asap
and let elbert/mcdonald/stults take the start.
I'm nobody's fool, least of all yours
by BoulderDodger on Aug 21, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions
whoops wrong one
i meant to write “fail” here.
fail.
I'm nobody's fool, least of all yours
by BoulderDodger on Aug 21, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions
torre is our guy
how can anyone doubt the power and expertise of joe torre. look at what he did in new york for 14 years and look what he did last year (his 1st in la). hes the phil jackson of baseball, the zen master. he doesnt need to run around and yell like lou pinnella does to get his players to kill for him. this shitty streak the dodgers are going through is pissing me off too. manny is sucking, furcal is non existent, and the pitching has done a complete 180 from the first half. they need to get padilla in there asap and fix that rotation for the playoffs. and i say give pierre more starts if manny keeps slumping. i mean he hit the granny coming off the bench, maybe give me a little incentive to earn that money. torre is gonna fix all that cuz he wants to win more than he lets on. gonna be a hell of a race down the stretch so cant wait for the next few weeks of ball…
lets not get padilla in there asap
and let elbert/mcdonald/stults take the start
I'm nobody's fool, least of all yours
by BoulderDodger on Aug 21, 2009 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Yet in 2006 with the same coaching and management for both teams
the Clippers advanced further in the playoffs.
by Michael White on Aug 21, 2009 4:01 PM PDT up reply actions
small sample size
lol… 1 year out of 70 years congrats
It's not exactly 70
and I wouldn’t disagree that it’s a small sample size except that it’s appropriate given the post. The poster said the Clippers will never reach the lakers because of coaching and management. In this case, I don’t have to prove that it will be a common occurence, just that it is not impossible. As 2006 clearly shows, it is not impossible.
by Michael White on Aug 21, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions
never ever?
i beg to differ
I'm nobody's fool, least of all yours
by BoulderDodger on Aug 21, 2009 11:52 PM PDT up reply actions
yeah, maybe
i should have chosen my words more wisely, but what I meant was that its highly unlikely for the clippers to stay on par with the lakers. It sounds like mwhite06 and matthewmafia got my point, but were just taking it to another level..?
The Clippers will be a great team if they can get a reliable scorer down low to compliment Griffin (not Kaman, please). Baron Davis has renewed his dedication to the team, and it sounds like he and Dunleavy are coming together a bit. So, this year should make most forget about last year.
Naw, shit, I’ll never forget last year. At least in LA we have two teams ;) (same with baseball)
agreed
you have an odd collaboration of favorite teams. although I completely back your liking of the Buffs. Go CU. and Go Dodgers.
I'm nobody's fool, least of all yours
by BoulderDodger on Aug 22, 2009 7:32 PM PDT up reply actions
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