Ricky Nolasco's Deal With Marlins Provides Framework For Chad Billingsley Contract Extension
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 1:00 PM PST
in Los Angeles Dodgers Payroll
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Now that we drafted the framework of a potential Clayton Kershaw contract extension, it is appropriate to move on to the Dodgers' other young starter, Chad Billingsley. Luckily, Ricky Nolasco and the Florida Marlins have provided the framework for such a deal. Nolasco signed a three-year extension with Florida worth $26.5 million, according to Joe Frisaro of MLB.com.
Billingsley compares quite favorably to Nolasco:
| Pitcher | W-L | IP | HR/9 | BB/9 | K/9 | ERA | ERA+ | FIP |
| Billingsley | 59-41 | 825.2 | 0.7 | 3.9 | 8.2 | 3.55 | 116 | 3.68 |
| Nolasco | 54-39 | 716.1 | 1.2 | 2.1 | 8.0 | 4.45 | 97 | 3.91 |
Billingsley has the better career numbers, is about a year and a half younger, and is coming off a better 2010 season. Nolasco was limited to 157 2/3 innings last year, while Billingsley threw 191 2/3 frames, his third straight season of 190 innings or more. However, Nolasco's contract is still a very comparable one for Billingsley, based on their respective service times.
At four years, 142 days service time (per Cot's Baseball Contracts), Nolasco has 32 more days of service time than Billingsley, but in reality Nolasco is a notch above Billingsley in service class. Nolasco was a Super Two free agent after the 2008 season, giving him an extra year of salary arbitration, boosting his salaries through those arbitration years. He made $3.8 million last season, while Billingsley made $3.85 million in his first year of arbitration eligibility. Nolasco's contract bought out his final two years of arbitration, plus his first year of free agency, in 2013. The same structure of a deal can work for Billingsley, given that he has two years of arbitration remaining as well, and made a similar salary in 2010.
I don't necessarily think Ned Colletti will sign Billingsley to a long-term deal this winter, but if he does, Ricky Nolasco has at least provided a blueprint for a contract.
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Switchboard Susan - by Nick Lowe
When I’m near you girl, I get an extension
And I don’t mean Alexander Graham Bell’s invention
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
What are people projecting
for Bills next year? I cringe at any trade Bills talk because it seems like he’s coming into his own and could be awesome next year.
I don't think anyone
is seriously thinking of trading Billz. I think just all the pitching that Ned is bringing in is making us wonder if a trade is in the works, and if they are trading a starter then Billz looks to be the odd man out. quite a few people here have said they would not like that possibility at all.
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 1:17 PM PST up reply actions
I’m actually expecting a year closer to 2009 than 2010 if something doesn’t change. His strike out rate has gone down by almost 1.5 since 2008 and his HR/FB was totally unsustainable last year.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 1:19 PM PST up reply actions
I remember them talking about his strikeouts going down at one point
then the next game he struck out like 11 D-backs
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 1:21 PM PST up reply actions
So I should point this out constantly?
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 1:22 PM PST up reply actions
if it
behooves you to do so :)
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 1:24 PM PST up reply actions
11 K's of the D-Backs
is the equivalent of what for a normal team? 6?
Overqualified in an underqualified world since 2008.
you can say that
but if you’re a strike out pitcher and you don’t K a bunch of those guys, I think that’s worse.
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 1:26 PM PST up reply actions
1.5 ?
2008 – 9.0 (his peak)
2010 – 8.0
His BB/9 last year was a career best 3.2. So one could also be cautiously optimistic.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
This is what I get for using BPs numbers instead of B-Refs.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 1:25 PM PST up reply actions
BPs numbers always leak all over the place
My belt holds up my pants and my pants have belt loops that hold up the belt. What the f*ck’s really goin' on down there? Who is the real hero?
I know similarity scores is crap for projection purposes,
but this is still an interesting list. Billingsley’s Most Similar Pitchers at age 25, per baseball-reference.com:
1. Jake Peavy (974)
2. Steve Busby (970)
3. John Smoltz (969)
4. Andy Benes (967)
5. Ramon Martinez (962)
6. Ray Culp (960)
7. Jose Rijo (960)
8. Don Wilson (960)
9. Sid Fernandez (960)
10. Stan Williams (960)
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
This is way off
No matter how big Chad’s ass is, it will never rival that of Sid Fernandez
Overqualified in an underqualified world since 2008.
by Pure Azure on Dec 20, 2010 1:28 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
This made me laugh
I remember the first time I saw him pitch, I was actually drawn first to his odd motion, like he was throwing the ball up, not down.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
I remember Busby only from some inherited 1970s Topps cards from my brothers.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 1:32 PM PST up reply actions
That is quite a great group of comps
I thought Busby had won a Cy but nope. Done at 26 after throwing 3 straight 230 innings per year.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
The HR/FB was lucky
no doubt, but his BABIP was unlucky for balls that stayed in the park.
by Michael White on Dec 20, 2010 1:52 PM PST up reply actions
Baseball HQ loves him headed into 2010
Reasons he breaks out in 2011: – Dom dip balanced by better Ctl and uptick in GB rate. – Has always shredded RHers, still improving v. LHers. Others think he’s peaked, but you see… UP: sub-3.00 ERA.
Billingsley achieved some gains in 2010, particularly in the second half, which allowed him to rebound from 2009. In fact, 2010 was a growth season for him as well as a bounce-back year:
* Cmd returned to 2008 level, buoyed by a marked improvement in Ctl, which compensated for a Dom decline.
* GB% surged, especially during the second half.
* The gains in Ctl, Cmd and GB% resulted in BPV and xERA approaching 2008 levels, with the second-half xERA representing an improvement upon 2008.
That Ground ball gain they are talking about in the 2nd half jumped to 52%. So while the home run rate was a miniscule 0.1 part of that besides luck was that his fly ball rate dropped from 35% to 30% in the 2nd half.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Make that headed into 2011
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
for Vikings & Bears, I’m OK with that :)
I meant awesome as in “I’ll watch and enjoy from my couch without having to deal with anything remotely as cold.”
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
I just can’t believe they are going to use that field. Unless they let them wear metal cleats, its going to be like running around on an ice rink, and if they do something to try to heat up the soil, it will be a mush-pit.
is it grass or artifical turf?
if it is grass then boo hoo to the players. I remember the Vikings/Rams playoff games back in the late 70s played in snow drifts. Then one year the Rams finally got to host the Vikings in a playoff game and it rained, haha. :)
FieldTurf to be specific
an artificial surface.
I have very, very bad memories of that last game you mentioned.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
That might get me to watch
a MNF game. I love snow football. Love it. I even loved playing in it.
Until it turned to ice, that was when we went home and had hot coco.
Can I be 10 again?
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Hot Coco
I’ll say!
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
Grow a pair. At least I don’t post pics of Gruden, who was more responsible for the loss with pussy play-calling in the second half.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 1:40 PM PST up reply actions
This might be the first time I watch Monday Night American Football all year
I of course never miss Monday Night Football in England, which is broadcast around noon pacific time. Still, I have a feeling there was more talent on the field in Manchester this afternoon (Pacific Time) than I will see on that frozen field in Minnesota. So playing in snow won’t be entertaining for more than an hour tops. Unless the Vikings somehow rediscover their true essence in the snow, and remember who they are.
Or to quote River Tam, “They weren’t cows inside. They forgot how to be. Now they see sky and they remember who they are.”
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:07 PM PST up reply actions
You likely saw more scoring today, too.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 4:08 PM PST up reply actions
The Vikings and Bears will need three touches, or touchdowns, combined to outperform Manchester City and Everton. Anyone want to take an over/under on this?
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:28 PM PST up reply actions
Are you considering that to be 18 points or 21?
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
18 points, since we’re going across scoring mechanisms, it’s the 6 point touch I’m interested in, not the point after. Thus it could also be twelve field goals.
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:36 PM PST up reply actions
or whatever the correct number of field goals would be
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:39 PM PST up reply actions
Unless Ned works out an extension to go into Chad's FA years
I don’t care if Chad remains year to year for the next 2 years.
Wouldn't the only point with two years on clock remaining
be to buy out a couple of FA years?
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
I remember Boras working out the deal for Gagne
that covered the last two arbitration-eligible years.
Two years to many
but your right.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
a four year deal does more
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
a five-year deal would be jive?
a six-year deal would keep him out of the sticks?
a seven-year deal would be heaven?
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 1:58 PM PST up reply actions
eight years would be great.
My belt holds up my pants and my pants have belt loops that hold up the belt. What the f*ck’s really goin' on down there? Who is the real hero?
But fuck a ten-year contract. That’s way too many years.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
Chad Billinglsey and the Los Angeles Dodgers agreed today to a 10-year, big-fat-hen contract, it was reported by the Associated Press. The contract will be under review by both the Commissioner and the players’ union, as it marks the first time in the modern history of the game that a player has been paid in livestock.
Commenting on the announcement, Dave Stewart, Billingsley’s agent, said, “Well, it’s not like he’s getting some scrawny, piece-of-shit hen. The contract specifically calls for a big, fat hen. So Chad is very happy that he’ll remain a Dodger for the next decade.”
Billingsley’s contract includes incentives; if he pitches 200 innings in 2018, 2019, or 2020, he will receive a prize pig.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:40 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
So is that
a Foster Farm hen
or
a Water filled wanna be Zacky Farm hen?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Zue5j9W5fQ
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
According to my sources, the contract is mute on that issue.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:46 PM PST up reply actions
It's amazing...........
How far rhis site will drop when there’s no real news.
I'm sayin' "What's in it for me?"
Just wait until you scroll down and see the Eckstein-for-HOF discussion.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:51 PM PST up reply actions
No one called the Viking
should be playing in a domed stadium. This is what they were meant to do. Alan Page nods in agreement from his place in the Supreme Court of Purple land. Now that was a Viking.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
I hated them
but that defensive liner was awesome
Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man
Me to
it was kind of like my hatred for the Reds, totally born of respect.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Pure Azure
I don’t think I’m going up for Kareoke. Sorry mate.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Until Eric
joins his crew in Los Angeles, weekday meets are going to be rare.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Hope this ain't old news but if it is so frigging what, this is cool
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
I read that earlier
the cynicism of some people was kind of a downer. I mean, those guys just wanted to say thanks to the best player (other than Longoria) that’s ever played there.
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 1:57 PM PST up reply actions
I think Ned will never ...........
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
get a LF that Dodger4Life wants
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
what about one I want?
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
FYI
Since 2006, only 22 players have played more than 120 games in their first year of MLB. Three were from the Japanese league, at least one was a Rule 5 draftee (Uggla), the Dodgers have two of them, Ethier and Martin (who were both up due to injuries).
Get out of here with your objective facts
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
I would have to google this
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Fact: no man that wears cowboy boots is shaving his junk.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
Done extensive research on the topic?
by Michael White on Dec 20, 2010 2:21 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
This is the perfect response to this BTW
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
It’s just plain common sense.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
Not even
this guy?
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
Even the Cowboy
who danced with the policeman/plumber/marine?
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
have hair again
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
His upper lip
has quite a bit.
"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
How funny would it be
if an opposing GM made that condition a part of a trade with the Dodgers?
“OK Ned, we’ll give you Justin Upton, but you gotta ditch the rug for a year.”
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 4:04 PM PST up reply actions
I don't check this enough at the door
“From an editorial perspective, we put all of our emphasis on being by, of and for the fan,” said chief executive Jim Bankoff. “Unlike a lot of other outlets, we will embrace bias and check objectivity at the door. We believe that spectator sports are about being subjective, not objective.”
I know I have a lot of fun
saying “Go fuck yourself Giants!” here. :)
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 2:13 PM PST up reply actions
We are
allowed to create the blog as we see fit. I’d say the writers here are very objective and if SB Nation doesn’t like it they can go GFY
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
I for one was a little shocked that the powers at be pretty much discredited the efforts of SBNation bloggers (starting with the A’s wasn’t it) who have worked hard to be respected as legitimate journalists
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:32 PM PST up reply actions
There is no such thing as objectivity in sports reporting. Yeah, yeah, they say “no cheering in the press box,” but sports journalism operates under completely different rules than news.
At least, it used to. These days it seems like objectivity is defined as “presenting both sides of the story,” when in fact there may be only one side to a story. If 99% of people think one thing, and 1% think the opposite, one didn’t use to have to present the 1 percent’s point of view in order to remain objective.
But hey, words mean whatever people who use them intend them to mean, so whatever.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 2:17 PM PST up reply actions
when in fact there may be only one side to a story
Really? how can there only be one side to a story? Any story? Anywhere?
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
At the risk of going political
….well, no, I don’t think I’ll go political.
Let’s just say that there are topics that are considered uncontroversial among people who are experts in that field, that are made controversial by people who know little or nothing about it.
Such topics are not “controversial” except to the extent that they are covered that way by the — hrm — objective press.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 2:24 PM PST up reply actions
There’s two sides to every story, just both sides aren’t equally right.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 2:26 PM PST up reply actions
Fine, I’ll back off of that. What I guess I mean is that a journalist can remain objective without presenting both sides as if they had equal merit.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 2:29 PM PST up reply actions
Sounds like Science
and if Science didn’t have a long history of being wrong about the things they were experts in then I might agree with that response.
I agree with Reg below.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
Sure
but the other side of the debate against science isn’t usually a competing scientific viewpoint, its that witches did it, or some other nonsense.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Vinny is the only objective reporter that I've heard in the broadcast booth
He’ll tell you when the Dodgers suck!
I'm sayin' "What's in it for me?"
Chick was pretty good about that too
Overqualified in an underqualified world since 2008.
by Pure Azure on Dec 20, 2010 11:05 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
they say? you sound like my father. it’s not a matter of what is said, it’s a matter of practice, you don’t cheer in the press box. you don’t let a coach off the hook after a tough game. And you don’t hesitate to praise a player from the opposing team if they earn it
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:34 PM PST up reply actions
What I’m saying is that “no cheering in the press box” has no currency.
One doesn’t cheer in the press box — heaven forfend! — but if you have an axe to grind, no matter how petty or small that axe is, anywhere else is fair game.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:41 PM PST up reply actions
you mean the press is free to write whatever it feels is fit to print?
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:43 PM PST up reply actions
There are ads here already. Would you like ads that you are forced to sit through every time you click “post”?
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
and you can’t simply cut and paste the print journalism modus operandi and expect it to work online
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:08 PM PST up reply actions
Thought they already had their own
except he could actually play CF.
You can be (incompetent and a nice guy), you can be (competent and an asshole), but if you are an (asshole and incompetent), your only future is to be Keith's boss otherwise you are unemployable
The Fox Sports / Yardbarker blog portion of their site is just garbage BTW. Nearly Geocities level of aesthetics.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 2:27 PM PST up reply actions
by all means
enjoy Angels
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 2:29 PM PST up reply actions
Right Handed Outfielders....
what’s Mitch Jones doing nowadays?
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 2:27 PM PST reply actions
He’s watching video — over and over again — of his 15 PA in The Show.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 2:29 PM PST up reply actions
did he go to Japan?
I vaguely remember that. I know he was with the Braves for a bit.
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 2:30 PM PST up reply actions
In reading the stories about Bob Feller, I am left with only one major conclusion.
Boy, do I wish my name was Cy Slapnicka. That is awesome.
Now with 33% more Kavula
Believe me, I’ve thought about it. I truly despise my name.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 3:02 PM PST up reply actions
Jon Heyman
has an FJM-worthy piece up on why he’s voting for Jack Morris but not for Blyleven. It includes one of my all-time favorite gems:
Morris has a high lifetime ERA, 3.90. But some of that is due to the 6.19 and 5.60 marks he put up in his final two seasons. And part of it is due to him pitching to the scoreboard, which the very best pitchers could do.
Eric Stults was a master of pitching to the scoreboard.
by Michael White on Dec 20, 2010 2:57 PM PST up reply actions
isn't the scoreboard in the outfield?
Pitching to it seems to be the wrong way to get batters out.
Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man
To be fair Morris was at his worst with a 6+ run support.
He wasn’t that great with 0-2 runs either though.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
I do not want to rant and rave at Heyman nearly as much for voting for Morris and not Blyleven as I do voting for Mattingly and not Bagwell or McGriff.
by StolenMonkey86 on Dec 20, 2010 3:39 PM PST up reply actions
At least he put Raines on there.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 3:40 PM PST up reply actions
Funny, I know it’s a lost cause, but I am getting pissed about Trammell not getting the love. He and Whitaker were awesome.
It’s been said before, but the HOF just does not know what to do about second basemen. Do you have any sense of what they’ll do with Jeff Kent? HR leader at the position, but “only” 377 home runs in a high offense era. Rep for a poor fielder. No idea what they’ll do with him.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 3:50 PM PST up reply actions
Not a chance, he’s a dick so they’ll use only 377 home runs (in the steroid era!) and bad defense as a reason to keep him out.
I’m big on peak so I think he’s an easy in, but guys who are focused on career numbers probably would say now. As it is now, he’d have one of the lowest WARs of any 2B in the Hall.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 3:54 PM PST up reply actions
I like the two comments above — that’s what I’m talking about!
I’ll take the middle road. He gets in, but it takes years for him to build the support.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:01 PM PST up reply actions
I agree
I think Kent gets in, but it takes him a few years (5ish?). Roberto Alomar might set the pace for Kent’s wait.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 4:03 PM PST up reply actions
They’d look a lot better at that position if they’d let in Grich and Whitaker.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:05 PM PST up reply actions
If you hit
a walk-off HR in Game 7 of the World Series, you’re in.
Overqualified in an underqualified world since 2008.
by Pure Azure on Dec 20, 2010 11:14 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
And making a turn of a double play
look like the ball bounced off your chest to the first baseman
by The Dude Abides on Dec 21, 2010 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
This might be my favorite Heyman entry.
15. Juan Gonzalez. On merit, he’s pretty darned close, with two AL MVP awards and some other dominant years. Jose Canseco raised the steroid issue for Juan Gone, and I’d like to defer the vote, under the assumption there will be a chance later for him to respond. This is one of many messy cases where there’s no failed test, admission or report from a reputable source (only Canseco), and voters have to make a judgment to exonerate, indict or defer. I decided to defer a "yes’’ vote under the assumption he gets the requisite five percent to make next year’s ballot.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:04 PM PST up reply actions
For context… unless I’m mistaken, Canseco “raised the steroid issue for Juan Gone” in 2005.
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by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:08 PM PST up reply actions
You could take the arguments he had against Blyleven and easily apply them to a dude who had 8 losing seasons, 6 seasons with 15 or more losses, a career win percentage lower than Blyleven’s, and never won a Cy Young Award. Except that guy was Nolan Ryan.
by StolenMonkey86 on Dec 20, 2010 3:50 PM PST up reply actions
Jack Morris is Bert Blyleven if you took out Blyleven 22-26 when he was an elite pitcher. I can see the argument for not letting Blyleven in, but there’s no way you can say no to Blyleven and yes to Morris.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 3:55 PM PST up reply actions
Lost in the news today that Pete Rose, Jr. will manage one of the White Sox minor league teams is that the dude played minor league baseball (including independent leagues) for 21 freaking years.
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 2:54 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
His only major league time was in 1997…14Abs with the Reds.
He had 6.938 ABs in the minors…
I’d have to believe that without that stint with the Reds, he may have had the all time record for most ABs in the minors without ever reaching the majors.
I have alot of respect for guys that would play in the minors for that long. If you told me that I could only play 5 years in the minors, but never reach the majors. Or I could just go to college, get a degree, and get a regular job…i’d probably pick college. Life in the minors isnt easy.
I bet his dad wouldn’t let him quit. “I played until I was 45,” says Rose the elder. “You will give this game everything you’ve got, too.”
I bet Pete Rose would be a real red-ass of a dad. They don’t call him Charlie Hassle for nothing.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 3:08 PM PST up reply actions
I wasnt intending to see a movie about ballerinas..
But I saw a clip today with Mila Kunis and Natalie Portman that made me reconsider. I’d link it but its probably NSFW, unless you work at Penthouse.
The sleeping giant on this list is also a Los Angeles team. The Dodgers’ Clayton Kershaw, Chad Billingsley, Hiroki Kuroda and Jon Garland combined for 50 wins and a 3.33 ERA in 127 starts. You can argue that only Garland, who benefited from working in San Diego’s Petco Park, delivered at peak form in 2010. And if you wanted to compare five-man rotations, sliding Ted Lilly in alongside Garland, the Dodgers would move a lot closer to the Phillies and Giants.
Everyone except Garland could improve on 2010.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 3:48 PM PST up reply actions
I think this is the first piece I’ve read that implies, at least indirectly, that Ted Lilly is the fifth starter.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 3:51 PM PST up reply actions
If Ted Lilly really is the fifth starter…. we’re probably not screwed?
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
Depends on how much you like Garland
and the 3 guys in front of him. In my case, oodles.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
is there any actual talk or rumor
of a Billingsley contract extension or is this just an exercise on the part of TBLA?
RIP Steve Landesberg
Hard to believe Abe Vigoda outlasted him
Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man
Dietrich!
Dang. That dude was funny. Or at least delivered his lines so they were funny. Or both.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGv_7VgFgeg&feature=related
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:21 PM PST up reply actions
I loved that show
I only strive to know the obscure facts about any topic that his character could rattle off.
Yeah, I kind of grew up to be Dietrich, too.
Of course, that is why Bride walks around with a picture of a rat’s ass.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:22 PM PST up reply actions
A couple of friends of mine and I
once wrote a comedic story with a kind of spy as the central character. We described him being of the Steve Landesberg type because we loved his work as Deitrich.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Dietrich does Gregory Peck
http://www.youtube.com/user/bluebourbon#p/a/u/0/6TwD3A28HmI
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
Classic
Landesberg roasts Goldwater:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-FBVOW7ATE&feature=related
Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man
Here's the thing about the HOF
Without their career numbers, I am pretty sure I would have a hard time saying Eddie Murray, Dave Winfield and Paul Molitor are worthy of it.
More Hall Of Fame Stuff
Kevin Brown: Hall of famer?
From 1995-2003 Brown had a 155 ERA+, and a 3.63 K/BB
Even though he wasn’t great in Texas he’s still got the 25th best ERA+ in the Hall.
On the other hand, he’s got less innings pitched than a lot of the Hall of Fame starters, so maybe he didn’t pitch for long enough.
@andrewngrant
I thought about him a few years ago
And it seems to me that Brown, Mussina, and Schilling are all remarkably similar. A vote for one might be a vote for all.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 4:54 PM PST up reply actions
I bet Schilling gets in
cos of his postseason achievements…Phils, D-Backs, Bloody Sox
Overqualified in an underqualified world since 2008.
Maybe he should
have punched fewer walls
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Does anyone remember Kevin Brown as one of the defining players of the previous era? Cause I sure don’t.
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 4:55 PM PST up reply actions
Eckstein is a hall of famer?
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
world series mvp
2 rings in a box, one of the most hated players in the league
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
I embellished
but he does get a lot of venom thrown his way, even on here.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
He had one of the defining contracts of the previous era.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
His definition improved quite a bit with the Dodgers, some special juice was to blame?
by 68elcamino427 on Dec 20, 2010 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
He just happened to pitch in an era when four of the five best pitchers ever were pitching. If Brown were putting up those kind of numbers now he’d be seen as elite. Brown’s peak is better than Johan Santana’s.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
He certainly earned elite money with the Dodgers and Yankees.
by 68elcamino427 on Dec 20, 2010 5:05 PM PST up reply actions
And he deserved every penny.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 5:07 PM PST up reply actions
257 K in 257 IP (1998) is pretty incredible.
How many others have had a perfect 9.0 K/9 with over 200 IP?
Kevin Brown, Daryl Kile, and Koufax.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 5:21 PM PST up reply actions
Done exactly two other times
Darryl Kile in 1996 – 231
Koufax in 1964 – 223
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Honorable mention to Chad Billingsley for 201 in 200 2/3rds IP.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
missed it by that much
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
If only that guy could have pitched into the sixth.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:30 PM PST up reply actions
but aren’t players judged relevant to their time?
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 5:29 PM PST up reply actions
And relative to his time, he was great, he just happened to be pitching with four other guys that were destroying records.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 5:33 PM PST up reply actions
My personal point of view on this, and all matters relating to the HOF, is that one should give a potential HOFer the most charitable reading one can and judge him on that. If he’s an extreme peak guy, judge him on his peak; if he’s got a low peak but was always very, very good, judge him on that; if he’s not the strongest player of his era but rates well against history, judge him on that; and if it’s a weak era, but he’s at the top, judge him on that.
Mind you, I don’t say automatically elect; I mean it as something to bear in mind as we review these guys.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
I'd say no
But I think Schilling will ultimately get in pretty easily while Brown will fall off the ballot with virtually no support, which is totally unfair.
Brown and Schilling have incredibly similar resumes. They came very close to pitching the same number of innings over the same time frame with the same ERA+ and the same win totals.
Apparently I recently passed 20,000 TBLA comments
This is comment number 20,466. I can’t imagine how Eric amassed over 25,000 comments in a single calendar year!
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
You might be over 30,000, but we’ll never know thanks to Phil and the inadvertent switch!
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 5:12 PM PST up reply actions
Not so
The comments disappeared, but comment count is not reset. One of the reasons I couldn’t guess what happened until Phil told me.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Cool
No artificial inflation of numbers needed!
Let it be said: David Young, 100% natural
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 5:16 PM PST up reply actions
I would give him 1.4 dollars to be on my roster. Maybe.
by hee came hee seop'd he choi'd on Dec 20, 2010 5:21 PM PST up reply actions
fuck this
I got free clippers tickets from a lawyer I work for that I now cant use because hes making everyone stay late
by hee came hee seop'd he choi'd on Dec 20, 2010 5:14 PM PST reply actions
I also couldnt find a way to get anyone to go with me in the first place so Im basically losing out on a solo trip to staples on a rainy night.. meh
by hee came hee seop'd he choi'd on Dec 20, 2010 5:17 PM PST up reply actions
There is a total lunar eclipse
tonight (actually early tomorrow morning) that happens to coincide with the winter solstice. This is the first time it has happened since 1638 – or while Galileo was still alive – and is visible throughout North America. Of course, the continuing rainstorm here in Southern Cal makes viewing impossible.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Is this a joke about some ancient myth that I do not know? Otherwise, I don’t get it.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
In a lunar eclipse, a full moon is blocked by the earth from the sun’s rays, but the light through the Earth’s atmosphere will give the moon a red tint, is what I read just now
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 6:05 PM PST up reply actions
Ditto here in SF
not betting on being able to see it tonight unless there’s a miracle clearing later. Sigh, oh well. I’ll watch the highlights on the Eclipse channel.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.
that’s about right. Anyone want to take my earlier over/under on the two teams combined offense: 18 points?
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 6:12 PM PST up reply actions
Oh, so defensive and special team touchdowns don’t count?
I was thinking over all the way, once I found out it was FieldTurf.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
17-7
now
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 6:43 PM PST up reply actions
we could call defensive and special teams tds the “own goal” factor. Doesn’t matter anyhow, 3.5 touches is more than the three goals scored in Manchester ealier, over takes it, American football wins
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 6:46 PM PST up reply actions
O.T.
Do you have an idea why Javier Hernandez ( chicarito) hasn’t been playing lately with Manchester United
by Dodgermanramon on Dec 20, 2010 6:51 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
off the cuff answer is that Wayne Rooney came back, but there might be more to it than that
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 6:57 PM PST up reply actions
Berbatov didn’t play against Arsenal either, the two of them have been great while Rooney was brooding. My guess is once Rooney is in form we’ll see the other two strikers get more time in the game and on the ball
by Josie Becker on Dec 20, 2010 7:05 PM PST up reply actions
One more Stats FYI
Kevin Brown’s career does compare favorably to Curt Schilling’s one wonders what would have happened had Dave Roberts not successfully stolen second, no bloody sock, no 7th game collapse by Brown, the Yankees probably beat the Cardinals and Brown has two rings and maybe a trip to the HOF.
I should have known
the HOFer was a Yankee.
@davidyoungtbla - The commenter formerly known as El Lay Dave.
Not good for Brown, but theres going to be lots of cases like this in the future.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 6:38 PM PST up reply actions
It will be interesting to see
how Andy Pettite, who will go over the innings mark if he pitches this year and how Schlling is viewed in comparison to Brown when their time comes for HOF voting.
Andy Pettitte is gonna Jack Morris his way to the hall.
Schilling should have a decent amount of support.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 6:51 PM PST up reply actions
Scotty P
The Angels are interested ! Come on Angels don’t let me down. Sign him fast before Ned gets jealous..
Catching up from this weekend
Regarfield said that Cain has been “a shitload” better than Billingsley the last two years. It pains me to see not just the rest of the country underrate Bills, but a fellow Dodger fan. Just absolutely rough man.
2008 WARs
Cain – 3.7
Billingsley – 4.4
2009 WARs
Cain – 3.5
Billingsley – 3.2
2010 WARs
Cain – 4.0
Billingsley – 4.6
Come on man, Cain has been better than Bills once in the last 3 seasons (and I haven’t looked back before 2008 to compare), there’s not even a doubt who the better pitcher is here.
"If we hit that bull's eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate"
I'm assuming you have those from fangraphs
if you look at BR it favors Cain by a farily large margin.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
to say bills was better last year
you have to completely go off of fip and xfip, and maybe cain has just been a lucky SOB over the last 3 years, but he has outperformed his fip and xfip by a large margin.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Historically, are there pitchers who were able to keep outperforming their FIP/xFIP by such wide margins over a 10- or 15-year career?
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 9:36 PM PST up reply actions
I don't know
but I wouldn’t be surprised.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Mark Buerhle’s pretty good at it.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 9:41 PM PST up reply actions
I was thinking of Kirk Rueter
but xFIP only goes back to 2002.
His 2002-2005 ERA was 4.41 and his xFIP was 4.98.
Over his entire career, his ERA was 4.27 and his FIP was 4.66, a smaller gap
by Eric Stephen on Dec 20, 2010 9:41 PM PST up reply actions
I ask because if you’re the Giants, you have to consider this when you think about signing Cain to a long-term deal. If he’s due to come crashing to earth, you wanna let him walk. But perhaps — and I’m making this up, obviously — pitchers who outperform their FIP/xFIP have certain traits in common, and perhaps Cain shares some of those characteristics…. I dunno.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 9:45 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah it does, it just thinks that being able to have fly balls go to outfielders isn’t a skill.
xFIP does have more predictive power than FIP, so there’s something to it.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 9:46 PM PST up reply actions
So XFIP projects a certain number of flyballs should be turned into extra base hits..but not necessarily homers?
I was thinking that they tried to normalize a percentage of flyballs that should go for homers….where I think some pitchers do have a skill of limiting homers even if they give up a higher than normal percentage of flyballs.
xFIP says every pitcher should have the same HR/Outfield fly ball ratio. It doesn’t (or shouldn’t, Fangraphs does for whatever reason) include popups so it accounts for pitchers being able to induce soft fly balls.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 9:55 PM PST up reply actions
I might believe this better if they normalized a HR/warning track fly ball ratio.
But just normalizing it for all regular fly balls i dont get.
And including pop ups isnt right either.
Not all fly balls are created equal.
Yeah, Fangraphs including popups is bad, but it’s hard to say that inducing 250 foot fly balls is a skill.
@andrewngrant
by regfairfield on Dec 20, 2010 10:27 PM PST up reply actions
250 foot fly balls
The Mariano Rivera special
My belt holds up my pants and my pants have belt loops that hold up the belt. What the f*ck’s really goin' on down there? Who is the real hero?
Fangraphs xFIP doesn't account for infield flies
it has tERA which does, though.
"If we hit that bull's eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate"
I haven’t checked in a while, but as I remember Cain usually outperforms his FIP and xFIP by a big margin, so I’m not sure if that indicates he really can perform at that higher level or if he gets very lucky. Hard to tell which. I never use B-R, only Fangraphs for most statistics. I very much believe that Billingsley is a better pitcher than Cain, though they are similar.
"If we hit that bull's eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate"
L.A. Times has a new toy. Mapping L.A.
http://projects.latimes.com/mapping-la/neighborhoods/
Where the Times tries to include demographics and other data about cities and neighborhoods in L.A. County.
I'm surprised by the racial diversity of Long Beach..
Snoop Dogg and Warren G had me believing something else.
the one guy who has less interesting interviews then Billz or Greinke
Brett Favre.
though let’s see if he announces his retirement.
"Heroes get remembered, but Legends never die."
by Tommy Blackjack on Dec 20, 2010 9:18 PM PST reply actions
QB
He does that at the end of every season.
Next August will be the only time to determine if he’s really retired.
I wouldnt put it past him to come back bc the Vikings dont have much at QB.
I have some sympathy for Favre on this score, which makes me alone in America.
I do wish Favre was more like Rickey Henderson. Henderson loved playing so much that he played for the San Diego Surf Dawgs when he couldn’t find a MLB gig. That is awesome.
I do wish Favre would say, screw it, I love football, I’m still good at it, and you can pull this goddam thing from my cold, dead hands. As long as there is somebody who thinks I can help them, I am gonna play.
Still, there’s clear pressure on him to retire, so I can see why he’d do this dance every year. It can’t be easy to know that you’re one of the all-time greats, you can still help a lot of teams, and people want you to hang ‘em up just because, y’know, your age reached a magic number and you aren’t quite at your peak anymore.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 9:50 PM PST up reply actions
I like watching him play.
I just dont like the media coverage.
I also used to like him personally…but his sending pics of his junk to Jen Sterger was a real dumbass thing to do.
Brett – you’re a married grandpa. The days of chasing young babes is over. Maybe he needs to learn how to hang it up in both ways?
You have misrepresented why people dislike favre
although I doubt you are unaware of that. If he wants to keep playing fine, but just fucking play. Don’t play games with the teams that are dependent on you making that decision. Don’t be a media whore about it. Show up and play like everyone else in training camp.
There is also the question of weather or not he is actually good at football anymore. Last year he was great, this year… not so much.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
He’s definitely good enough to start for a few teams in the league. The talent at QB just isnt that great in the NFL.
I’d venture to say he could probably play till he’s 50yrs old in a backup QB capacity also.
sure
but he wants to play for good teams, and that greatly limits, if not eliminates his choices.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
true
Plus at some point he has to think about the rest of his life health wise. I cant imagine how much pain medication a guy like that has to take just to play in the NFL each week.
He’s probably doing long term health damage the longer he plays…I dont think he’s had the problem with concussions at least.
Don’t be a media whore about it. Show up and play like everyone else in training camp.
The extent of my sympathy for Favre depends on how much you think he is different from everybody else. Most players do not have the luxury of deciding when and under what circumstances they will end their careers, but Favre is one of them.
If you think that his annual act is all part of The Brett Favre Show, well, I can’t disagree. But I think there’s some possibility that he’s really not that savvy about it — that he knows that that the “normal” thing to do is to retire at this point, and he’s enough of a crowd-pleaser to want to do the “normal” thing, but he can’t… quite… bring himself to do it.
Now with 33% more Kavula
by Humma Kavula on Dec 20, 2010 10:01 PM PST up reply actions
No
No way Brett Favre pretends to retire every year just because he thinks its what he is supposed to do.
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
Just a crazy football genius?
One of the toughest players ever?
Diva?
Media Whore?
Addictied to the next dose of pain as well as the drugs?
Just gotta make one more play?
by 68elcamino427 on Dec 20, 2010 11:03 PM PST up reply actions
sometimes I read my own comments and think
“geez what a douche”
"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."
by nolander on Dec 20, 2010 11:20 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
ha
I want to rec this so you can be inspired to make that your tag line.
by StolenMonkey86 on Dec 20, 2010 11:43 PM PST up reply actions
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