Joe Nathan completes the trifecta
by Phil Gurnee on Mar 9, 2010 8:36 AM PST
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PrintSeveral years ago when of the great trades of the 21st century took place when the Twins unloaded A.J. Pierzynski i for Joe Nathan, Francisco Liriano, and Boof Bonzer. By late summer of 2006 that looked like one of the most lopsided trades in memory.
Liriano in 2006 was looking like Johan Santana with his killer slider and explosive fastball. An All-Star at the age of 22 Liriano was riding high headed August. He had a 1.96 ERA on July 28th and then Tommy John said hello. It is 2010 and the hope is he can regain some of the magic of 2006 but it has been three years since he was relevant.
Boof Bonzer was a former number one pick of the Giants and while he never lived upto that expectation he was a member of the Twin rotation in 2006/2007/2008. Tommy John bypassed Boof but the dreaded torn labrum did not. He missed all of 2009 and is now trying to make it in the Red Sox bullpen.
Joe Nathan has been one of the best closers in baseball since the Twins acquired him. Tommy John stopped by his house yesterday.
Three pitchers, two great ones, all visited by Mr.John or Mr.Labrum.
So what does that mean for the Dodgers. Maybe nothing, maybe everything. The Dodgers have an ex-closer at a good price. The Twins jumped their payroll this year to over $100 Million expecting to contend for the AL Central. Are they going to let some guys by the name of Guerrier or Rauch try to shoulder the load. Rauch doesn't seem to have the stomach for such a task. Pat Neshek is coming off his own TJ surgery. I'd say this team make look to upgrade.
What do they have that we could use. How about Wilson Ramos? They have Mauer they don't need Ramos. The Baseball HQ report on him:
Comments: Strong and athletic catcher missed significant time due to finger and hamstring injuries. Possesses plus raw power, but focuses more on contact from line drive swing. Needs to become more selective, but could hit for both BA and HR. Fundamentally sound receiver with plus arm strength and agility.
Scott Elbert in all likelihood could replace Sherrill in the bullpen, but what if Kuo goes down again?
Anyway use this thread for possible trade scenarios if you want to have some fun.
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I think we would probably see Zerpa or Leach take over the second lefty spot, at least early on, while Elbert goes downt to continue a stater’s routine.
Do you really need a second lefty spot?
I would think Elbert gets the call because 1) He’s a lefty 2) he can start in a pinch 3) He figures to be in the Dodgers plans in the future so it’s not a bad idea to see what he can do in the majors.
by Michael White on Mar 9, 2010 8:48 AM PST up reply actions
I think it would be necessary, especially since Kuo is not someone you can go to everyday and he is really too good to be used strictly as a LOOGY. I think you would want someone who could come in and get a lefty hitter out in the 6th or 7th. Elbert is probably most talented but maybe too talented to be wasted as a LOOGY. Zerpa and Leach really fit that mold.
Ya. True enough. Kuo would be moved to the 8th inning role so there wouldn’t really be a LOOGY otherwise. Still, I think just getting Elbert on the major league roster is a good start. But with Elbert’s control issues, perhaps a more refined pitcher would be the way to go, if the target is slated as only a LOOGY.
by Michael White on Mar 9, 2010 9:02 AM PST up reply actions
I guess this depends on Colletti v Torre, but I think Elbert needs to be starting every 5th day, even if it’s in ABQ. Otherwise, you get stuck with a situation where they need a starter in a pinch, but can’t use the relieving Elbert because “he’s not stretched out enough.” Just have him start every 5th day, so he’s ready at any point the Dodgers need a starter.
Eric mentions that the Twins like
Guerrier but from a skills perspective he’s not very good. How many closers have a K rate less then 6? He’s a control pitcher not closer material. Rauch has imploded enough that even with the skills no manager unless desperate is going to hand him the ball.
Kerry Wood is a possibility for them but they may not want to strengthen a young Indian team. If the Dodgers are willing to move Sherrill this might be the team to hook up with.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
From the last thread
The Twins are easily a contender this season, they have a great lineup but their rotation seems a bit suspect. I think they were counting on Nathan to ensure they had a shutdown bullpen to make up for some of depth issues in the rotation. I am sure they have some good arms, but I would imagine they would like to have someone with a history of success in the closer position. I don’t think Rauch is that guy.
They also need a 3rd baseman
You think the Carroll deal is bad look at what the Twins are paying Punto.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
That looks to me
like they need an outside option.
Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen
Wilson
Impressive numbers when you consider that he missed time with a broken finger and slightly torn hamstring.
It would be completely anti-Ned
to trade Sherrill for a prospect or two though. The only thing he has done even remotely close to that is the Pierre trade, and that doesn’t really count.
My prediction for the Twins is they promote someone from within or go with a closer by committee situation. Possibly they trade for someone just for bullpen depth.
You're forgetting Andre Ethier
And why doesn’t the Pierre trade count? It was assumed by just about everyone that the Dodgers would just swap one bad contract for another, yet Ned actually picked up a couple of seemingly decent enough pitching prospects. I’d agree that his record is definitely more lopsided in trading prospects than obtaining them, but come on now- let’s give credit where credit’s due.
Because Pierre had no starting job on the team while Sherrill is the setup man. Your Bradley for Ethier deal is a better comparison. Of course, Bradley was a special situation as well.
by Michael White on Mar 9, 2010 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
I was very satisfied with what Ned got for Pierre
And obviously with what he got for Bradley. That being said, I think both of those cases can be considered exceptions, because in both cases those players essentially had to be moved. Pierre was a useless albatross and moving him provided some salary relief, and Bradley was a bad little boy that it seemed clear the club wanted to get rid of.
Sherrill is much different, because he has real value. At this point, he has a relatively important role on the club, and doesn’t have a bad contract.
Don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t mind moving Sherrill for some legit prospects. I just don’t see it happening.
by BFDC on Mar 9, 2010 11:16 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I understand what you're saying
but I think it’s still worth giving Ned credit for getting prospects, in spite of the fact that the circumstances of those two trades weren’t typical. In fact, he may even deserve MORE credit for getting prospects in those circumstances, given what a disadvantage the Dodgers were at (granted, he created the Pierre situation himself, but nevertheless…). I do agree that based on what we’ve seem from Ned, it’s very difficult to imagine Sherrill getting moved for legit prospects, but you never know- circumstances are quite different now than when he made all those other moves. I think trading him to Minnesota for an upper-level position player or two would be great. But please- no more pitching prospects! I love the fact that the Dodgers have so many good ones now, but there are more than enough for the foreseeable future. About 2 or 3 positions are going to need to be filled by ‘12 (hopefully not more, depending on the McCourts), and you’d basically need ALL the prospects whose names we know now to work out in order to fill those holes. Definitely not a risk worth taking, if there are other viable options.
As for Pierre being a “useless albatross”…well, I’d probably have written a paragraph or two on that when I first joined here, but I know better now. LOL I’ll just agree to be glad for the two pitching prospects, and wish him well in the Windy City…
The difference is the situation. Right now we have a plethora of arms competing for just a couple of bullpen spots and we have a pretty highly paid setup man, but not too outrageously priced as closers go. I could see Ned viewing Sherrill as a luxury, especially if he can get a couple of useful young players in return and free up some dollars that can be used later in the season to possibly acquire a starting pitcher if the need is there.
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