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Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

D-Backs 9, Dodgers 7: Time To Vent

Russ Ortiz took the loss tonight, but he wasn't the only disappointing pitcher for the Dodgers

I have never run a marathon (I know, shocking, right?) -- I have run a 10K though -- but I imagine how I feel at the end of tonight's five-hour game is how one must feel after running a marathon.  I'm tired, I want nothing more than to sleep, and I feel like I need to throw up.

I'll have the game recap up later, but for now use this as the venting thread.

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That’s what Eric Karros always used to say

by 68elcamino427 on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

Joe Torre Quote

“We have to find out where we go and what’s going to give us the best chance to win a ballgame.”

Enter Russ Ortiz

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:12 AM PDT reply actions  

I didn’t realize Ellis had pinch hit for Russ Ortiz. I guess the 12th would have been interesting indeed

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 AM PDT reply actions  

Think the reporters will ask why Torre didn’t allow Broxton to pitch two innings?

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

It might vary as “will Broxton pitch tomorrow” but he will come up

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

Broxton doesnt pitch tomorrow and we lose

Torre saves him for nothing and we are 3-6
Besides Haren is on the mound and he owns us.

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

No

Its pretty much accepted he’s a one inning guy. But I am going to keep saying this, Bills should have gone 7 innings and left with a 5-2 lead.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

You think the ump screwed him up?

by Julio Nievas on Apr 15, 2010 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

Lopez

wasn’t getting the same strikes as Billingsley either, though.

I keep trying to reset my password to "penis", but it keeps telling me "too short".

by DbacksSkins on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

Elaborate on should have.

by dsm9412 on Apr 15, 2010 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

as in, should have pitched better

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 12:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

Like I said in the previous thread.

I expect some bullpen changes before the weekend is over.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 AM PDT reply actions  

Ah well....

Fuckit. On the bright side, Charlie Haeger came in relief and didnt screw up. The offense is ridiculous……and unfortunately so is the bullpen

by EephusBlue on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 AM PDT reply actions  

Is that a good or bad thing? Me seeing Haeger in meant that he is out as the 5th starter. I could be wrong, because it was just one inning, but I didn’t like seeing him in there tonight.

by Ivdown on Apr 15, 2010 1:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

No

Torre has said he would use Haeger in between starts if needed

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 1:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh ok. That’s good news then.

by Ivdown on Apr 15, 2010 1:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well

That would have been a lot more tolerable if I had been able to vent in the previous threads. What an absolutely wretched game.

by prosellis on Apr 15, 2010 12:13 AM PDT reply actions  

The problem isn't Russ Ortiz

I know he is the fall guy but the last two games just go into the argument that the Dodgers don’t have an “Ace” and that Kershaw is too young and Bills falls aparts once things get rough.

The first half of 2009 is ancient history and this team isn’t going anywhere untl those two guys start pitching more consistently.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:14 AM PDT reply actions  

But...

At least we know they can be good. They are capable of being good pitchers. Can we say the same about either Ortiz, Monsterios, or Weaver?

by prosellis on Apr 15, 2010 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

But you can't expect to have to bring in any reliever

4, 5, 6 times in the first 2 weeks of the season. Good ones, bad ones, they will fatigue. The Ortizes are an easy target but they deflect a lot of what the real problems are and I am not leaving Padilla out of this either but Bills and Kershaw are the two guys that need to do better.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed

But when we talk about ways of immediately improving the team, the bullpen seems to be the most obvious place to start.

by prosellis on Apr 15, 2010 12:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

Craig is right

the bullpen blows, but it weakness is only magnified by our starters inability to pitch well.

Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen

by Phil Gurnee on Apr 15, 2010 12:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

But being in a positon of having a Russ Ortiz as a part of your bullpen is a problem.
Last season things worked out great, so far this year not so much

by 68elcamino427 on Apr 15, 2010 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

Last year at this time Billingsley was running through the NL and the bullpen was dominating.

by dsm9412 on Apr 15, 2010 12:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

While I agree the roation isnt doing the bull-pen any favors

If you cant get 3 outs without giving up a run, you shouldnt be pitching. Ortiz you blow

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

Disappointed in Chad

Great stuff in 3 innings, then gives up a HR to Drew and never gets back in rhythm. I don’t know what it was, but I don’t understand how he couldn’t go back in rhythm. I hate our bullpen. I hate Torre for not letting Broxton pitch the 3 guys he needed to pitch to, most of all I hate this loss.

by Julio Nievas on Apr 15, 2010 12:16 AM PDT reply actions  

The bullpen only gave up 3 of the 9 runs

Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen

by Phil Gurnee on Apr 15, 2010 12:17 AM PDT reply actions  

That said

this bullpen has three pitchers on it that don’t belong in Ortiz Squared, and Monk.

Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen

by Phil Gurnee on Apr 15, 2010 12:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yes

Right now you have a perfect storm, bad guys at the back end of the pen and starters that can’t even pitch 6 innings.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

They could release somebody tonight

and bring up Elbert – guess not
                        McDondald – guess not
                        Link – guess not
                        The German – Guess Not

Never mind

Patience is for those who die waiting for something to happen

by Phil Gurnee on Apr 15, 2010 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

The Dodgers have only lost 5 games (including tonight) with 19 hits, since moving to LA

http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/N3CKr

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 12:19 AM PDT reply actions  

The Bad Ortiz
Who was really the better Ortiz
Pitched better than
The Good Ortiz
Who was really the worse Ortiz
Who now is once again
The Bad Ortiz

by Xeifrank on Apr 15, 2010 12:21 AM PDT reply actions  

Hahaha. This put a smile on my face.

by Ivdown on Apr 15, 2010 1:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

Torre after the game:

“Russ Ortiz just didn’t look comfortable and he let it get away.”

by silverwidow on Apr 15, 2010 12:21 AM PDT reply actions  

thanks for that torre

now tell me broxton couldnt come out and pitch the 11th

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

I would have been pissed

If he brings in Broxton to pitch the 11th in the 8th game of the season

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

We are gonna need all the wins we can get

Nl West is gonna be tough. .. we cant afford to give games away

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

For the record, it’s a fake quote. Or maybe not.

by silverwidow on Apr 15, 2010 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ortiz never looks comfortable on the mound though. When has he looked comfortable?

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

BTW, guaranteed

Tony Jackson, Dylan H will all focus on Bills.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:22 AM PDT reply actions  

Its a popular refrain for them.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

I understand that

but when Bills can’t get through the 6 without allowing 6 runs, they kind of have a point.

by Nofatmike on Apr 15, 2010 12:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

Isn’t pitching a main part of the defensive game?
Torre is probably just overly tired at this point this morning and just babbling

by 68elcamino427 on Apr 15, 2010 12:27 AM PDT up reply actions  

Joe Torre: Got into some bad counts, tried to overthrow the ball in the last inning.

First three innings were good, but that last inning was frustrating for him.

Ability wise they(the team) can do it, they just gotta focus.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:26 AM PDT reply actions  

The starters inability to go deep into games

Bad defense, poor situational hitting, you cannot put that all on the bullpen.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

It still is a major reason why they lost this game, and the majority of games this season.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

Let's see

If the Dodgers score a runner from third with no outs in the 9th inning in Game 2, Broxton can come in and close the door; Game 3, no need for Broxton to work that game. Game 4, even if Broxton pitches that day, he can still pitch in Game 5. Game 6, if Kemp catches the fly ball in the 6th, the Dodgers maintain the 5-3 lead and maybe Haegar can even go one more inning. They might not have had Broxton for Game 6 but perhaps Troncoso and Sherill get it done.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well, it’s a hypothetical.

by dsm9412 on Apr 15, 2010 12:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

You want to use Broxton 2 innings tonight when there is no guarantee

He doesn’t give up a run plus you may put him out of action for the next 2 days.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

He gives us a better opportunity to win the game

Who knows if we use him the next couple of days. Haren and Lincecum are scheduled to pitch in the coming days. So instead of trying to win, we are saving him in hopes hes available for the future. I dont like that mindset at all

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

So your argument is that Torre should have managed Broxton’s use better?

Isn’t that a failing of his bullpen management in general and of the bullpen?

We didn’t have this problem last year because the quality of the bullpen was so much better. It almost didn’t matter who Torre threw up in any inning because when a reliever gave up a run, it was the exception, not the expectation.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

Nope

My argument is that you can’t just blame the pen or Torre’s usage of it. Lots of factors go into these losses, missed opportunities to drive in a run, a dropped fly ball, the inability of a starter to go one extra inning.

Yes the pen has been exposed but the rest of team have done them no favors by putting them in those situations.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

But I’m saying a significant part of these losses is the bullpen. While its true that missed opportunities to drive in crucial runs, bad defense, or starters not being able to go farther than they should are problems, but they’re regular and expected problems every team has, and happens during the course of the baseball game.

But we all expected the bullpen to be good again this year and frankly its disappointing that its not.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

BH - You're presenting a very rational argument in an irrational time.

One that I agree with.

My take is that it’s end of the first week and by the end of April, the bullpen will have the proper pieces to it. By the All Star break, we won’t even remember what happened in April – except for maybe Hiroki’s no-hitter tomorrow ;)

by JJ 24 on Apr 15, 2010 12:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

Broxton shouldnt be pitching in half the games hes pitched so far

THe failings of the Ortizes have forced him to pitch in games that were blow-outs at the time. Ive taken for granted what it means to have a quality bull-pen. For the past 5-6 years weve always had someone step up and surprise us and a pen we could rely on. It pains me to say that i Miss Mota but at this point, he would be our 3rd best pitcher

by SeanMillerSavior on Apr 15, 2010 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Early season pattern does not bode well for another playoff run

by 68elcamino427 on Apr 15, 2010 12:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Why is Prime Ticket playing an infomercial for UCLA during a Dodgers broadcast?

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:28 AM PDT reply actions  

Producers in the van at Dodger stadium or sleeping now.

by prosellis on Apr 15, 2010 12:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

Because no one watches FSN at 12:30 in the morning

by Julio Nievas on Apr 15, 2010 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

Is there a reason why tomorrow’s game is starting at 6:30??

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:32 AM PDT reply actions  

It's not

pregame show starts at 6:30.

7:10 game start

by Eric Stephen on Apr 15, 2010 12:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Pregame show starts at 6:30. Game starts at 7:10.

by silverwidow on Apr 15, 2010 12:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ned Colletti didn’t name any specific pitcher as he was calling out his team’s staff on Wednesday for its failure to consistently throw strikes, but the Dodgers general manager didn’t really have to. Anyone who had seen the club’s first seven games this season knew who the culprits were, and besides, there were so many culprits that Colletti didn’t really have time to name them all because manager Joe Torre was waiting to talk to him.

“Our pitching staff has been upside down with walks and falling behind hitters,” Colletti said. "You can’t continue to pitch behind in the count at this level and expect to get away with it. If you look at rallies late in games, almost always, at the beginning or in the middle of them, there is a walk. I’m not big on statistics, but if you look at 1-0 (counts) versus 0-1, I’m pretty sure you will see a dramatic difference in what hitters do. I’m hopeful that it’s just the early part of the season putting us in that position. But it needs to get better, sooner rather than later.’’

http://sports.espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/news/story?id=5090378

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:42 AM PDT reply actions  

Frankly

Outside of Broxton, Troncoso and Kuroda, he’s calling out everyone.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think Heager’s safe as well.

by Tripon on Apr 15, 2010 12:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe

Since the nature of his game is to be somewhat wild.

by bhsportsguy on Apr 15, 2010 12:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

“…I’m not big on statistics…”

Straight from the horses’ mouth.

by Nofatmike on Apr 15, 2010 12:47 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

The Ortiz boys

have no business being on the roster. Ramon got out of a jam tonight, but has been bad. Russ was awful again. I know that we have Beli and Kuo close to being back in a week or so, but how many games are we going to lose because we can’t close the deal before that? If R n R Ortiz can’t produce, we have to consider going to Alb and getting J Mac and others to replace them. Sorry for the rant, just frustrated and want us to perform better. Go Blue!

by keithc13 on Apr 15, 2010 1:08 AM PDT reply actions  

Lots of things are hurting this team right now.

Russ Ortiz and Ramon Ortiz have no business pitching in the major leagues. After tonight Lindblom and Mcdonald better be highly considered a bullpen spot. Lindblom would be better to bring up now because he has 3 options, Mcdonald only has 2 left I believe, and it’s still a while till any relief comes from Belasario or Kuo.

Matt Kemp is hitting very well, but his defense is worse than I would play in cf. Quite frankly it’s a disgrace right now. I love Kemp but he needs to focus when he’s playing defense, it’s really inexcusable how bad he’s been so far on defense.

The rotation is worse than advertised by the national media, and it just makes me groan. It’s not because they are right, but because they think they are right because of A. Padilla starting the season opener and B. The rotation sucking complete ass so far minus 2 or 3 starts. The walks are killing us so far, and the bullpen is being severely overused, and at this point that cannot happen.

The bullpen is the worst thing about this team so far, and it was the best thing about it last year. The only pitcher not to have a bad outing so far has been Broxton (and I think Troncoso actually), and everyone else has run into at least one bad outing. We need Kuo and Belasario badly.

The offense is near the top of the league right now…and we’re still not able to score. Yes I believe we’re scoring about 6 runs a game, but with how many people the Dodgers are getting on base there is no way this team should get 19 fucking hits and score 7 god damn runs. Sorry for the language, but it’s extremely ridiculous to average more than 2 runners an inning and only score 7 freaking runs. Just flat out terrible (and I hate to say this) clutch hitting. UGHHHH.

James Loney is so horrendous looking at the plate. His 2nd to last at bat I could barely stand to watch. It seems like he is simultaneously bailing out, getting on his front foot, and dipping his swing. What in the hell is wrong with his swing? No wonder he’s got no power, that swing looks awful. Maybe I’m seeing it wrong, but from what I see he needs to make some major mechanical adjustments to his swing. Holy crap. Not only that, but he managed to have the most worthless 2-6 in the history of mandkind. Both hits were singles, neither one led to a run, he left 7 on base, and he wasted a leadoff double by Manny I believe in the 9th and went on to have the worst at bat I’d ever seen him have. It’s dumb to cast off Loney right now a week into the season, but he really needs to start slugging more than .350+ like last week or he’s not going to have much of a future with this team after 2010.

I know some of these look like knee jerk responses, which may be some part of it, but I don’t understand how such a good team can be so bad at the same time. Tomorrow needs to be a big game for Kuroda.

by Ivdown on Apr 15, 2010 1:50 AM PDT reply actions  

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Pos No Player 2012 Salary
C 17 Ellis $490,000
1B 7 Loney $6,375,000
2B 37 Herrera $375,082
3B 6 Hairston $2,250,000
SS 9 Gordon $485,000
LF 23 Abreu $401,311
CF 10 Gwynn $850,000
RF 16 Ethier $10,950,000

OF/1B 33 Van Slyke $388,197
2B/3B 3 Kennedy $800,000
OF/1B 30 Sands $375,175
IF 13 DeJesus $448,992
C 18 Treanor $850,000

SP 22 Kershaw $6,000,000
SP 58 Billingsley $9,000,000
SP 29 Lilly $12,000,000
SP 44
Harang $3,000,000
SP 35 Capuano $3,000,000

CL 74
Jansen $491,000
RHP 52 Lindblom $483,000
RHP 51 Belisario $414,426
RHP 54 Guerra $488,000
RHP 28
Wright $900,000
LHP 57 Elbert $488,500
RHP 60 Coffey $1,000,000

DL 27 Kemp $10,000,000
DL 21 Rivera $4,000,000
DL 12 Sellers $481,000
DL 5 Uribe $8,000,000
DL 55 Guerrier $4,750,000
DL 14 Ellis $2,500,000
60DL 36 Hawksworth $495,000
60DL 41 De La Rosa $485,000

AA 50 Eovaldi $7,885
AAA 56 Antonini $7,869



Manny $8,087,432 deferred


Andruw $3,375,000 deferred


Pierre $3,050,000 deferred
Furcal $3,000,000 deferred
Kuroda $2,000,000 deferred
Garland $1,500,000 option buyout
Blake $1,250,000 option buyout
DFA 66 MacDougal $650,000

Totals
$115,942,869

For more detailed information, click here.

Current 40-man roster count: 42
(incl. De La Rosa & Hawksworth)

Yahoo_full_count

Manager

Eric___ned___reporters_2011_trade_deadline_small Eric Stephen

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100_1427_small Phil Gurnee

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